Is Xball ever coming to the uk?

[Iron Lions - Ed]

Perhaps, but X-Ball isn't that thing.

 

[Robbo]

You clearly know a hell of a lot more about the politics of balling, but what i am saying is that if there was something the players wanted so badly, they would refuse to play until the change was made then surely the league would want to keep its self running by making that change.

Chris, it's not so much the politics of Paintball that determines the ineffectiveness of player power at this juncture, I will explain.
At the moment we are in the process of courting mainstream TV.
Top dog in this enterprise is the NPPL.

They will do what it takes to make damned sure the product they have is what TV wants, not what the player wants, TV is the one that needs to be satisfied here.
If we allow player power to set the direction then we immediately restrict our evolutionary path because it may well not be what's best in trying to make sure they get a successful TV product.

And so, the game will be formatted accordingly.
Thus far the 7 man edited down version has proven to be a successful candidate, it has certainly been the most successful production thus far.
Now in my opinion, the success has more to do with the production itself rather than the format but as far as the NPPL guys go, why tinker with something if it's working.
Basically don't try to fix it if it ain't broke is the philosophy that underpins their stance at the moment.

With this in mind, they see the 7 Man format as the vehicle most likely to get Paintball onto TV and if you think that us players voting for XBall is gonna derail that then I'm afraid you are gonna be disappointed.

In my opinion, a tweaked XBall is by far a better version to adopt but I ain't gonna be criticising the NPPL guys too much because they gotta go with what's proved successful so far.

OK, so you say, what's this gotta do with the Millennium and Europe?
Everything I'm afraid because Europe will follow suit, it has to..the industry spans both sides of the Atlantic, we are gonna be promoting international tourneys that involve everyone and as such, we need a common format and if a successful TV deal is reinforcing that standardisation, the Millennium guys are hardly likely to don their King Canute crowns and endeavour to resist the 7 man format tide coming across the Atlantic, nah it ain't gonna happen.

Player power in terms of format determination on either side of the water is not gonna happen in the short term Chris, no way.

 

[chrismrgn]

Yea i see your point, but it is a shame that big business and money takes priority over players opinions.

So do you think that in the longer run that there will be one main world wide league in which 7-man will be played and shown on TV. Or is there still the need not to have a monopoliy power heading the paintball scene and so to have oligopolistic leagues all competing for players and TV exposure?

Where as you would see the format that won the players playing Xball, and the league that won the TV playing 7-man. But even then which league would prove to be more sucessful? This surely brings us back to the NPPL and NXL of old... with NPPL having most of the coverage, and NXL having lots of the big name teams.

This again leaves us with the two main US leagues, and then the European millenium. If we go about the TV route, yes it will make paintball have a bigger profile, but I for one can see it ending at more or less the same point it is at the moment. One league having TV coverage playing 7-man, one having loads of teams playing Xball, and a european league as we felt left out...

 

[Robbo]

Yea i see your point, but it is a shame that big business and money takes priority over players opinions.

So do you think that in the longer run that there will be one main world wide league in which 7-man will be played and shown on TV. Or is there still the need not to have a monopoliy power heading the paintball scene and so to have oligopolistic leagues all competing for players and TV exposure?

Where as you would see the format that won the players playing Xball, and the league that won the TV playing 7-man. But even then which league would prove to be more sucessful? This surely brings us back to the NPPL and NXL of old... with NPPL having most of the coverage, and NXL having lots of the big name teams.

This again leaves us with the two main US leagues, and then the European millenium. If we go about the TV route, yes it will make paintball have a bigger profile, but I for one can see it ending at more or less the same point it is at the moment. One league having TV coverage playing 7-man, one having loads of teams playing Xball, and a european league as we felt left out...

'Oligopolistic'.......W....T....F is that?

Sounds like an old person's bone condition ... you better not be having a dig at me ??????




I'll answer your post later, I'm off to train my triceps

 

[chrismrgn]

'Oligopolistic'.......W....T....F is that?

Sounds like an old person's bone condition ... you better not be having a dig at me ??????

Its an economics term for when a group of 2-5 companies (the leagues) are in control of the market. They can choose to force competition out by forming cartels, can work together, or can simply carry on with massive control over the market.

EDIT; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oligopoly for a full discription.

 

[Magic_8ball]

Woah

Somebody used a word that Robbo didnt know :O

Im impressed! I had know idea chris was so intelligent (geek)

I gotta admit admit im kind of surprised to see some actual intelligent, sensible debate taking place on the forums!

 

[Robbo]

Woah

Somebody used a word that Robbo didnt know :O

Im impressed! I had know idea chris was so intelligent (geek)

I gotta admit admit im kind of surprised to see some actual intelligent, sensible debate taking place on the forums!

I'm afraid the use of big words in itself doesn't constitute intelligence or indeed sensible debate; they have to be understood, appropriate and crafted otherwise it just comes across as pretentious.....

And Magic, there's plenty of words I don't understand mate, words like 'designer gun cheating' or 'counter coaching', I just don't understand them.....nor want to..

 

[chrismrgn]

I'm afraid the use of big words in itself doesn't constitute intelligence or indeed sensible debate; they have to be understood, appropriate and crafted otherwise it just comes across as pretentious.....

And Magic, there's plenty of words I don't understand mate, words like 'designer gun cheating' or 'counter coaching', I just don't understand them.....nor want to..

Lol fair enough, but back to the topic, forgetting the use of the word, is mine a valid point in any way lol?

 

[MissyQ]

yeah, until you realise the guy that invented it was called knickerbocker, as in glory.
Its illegal in the US, where it is known as carteling, and it is not what is actually happening, so would be a poor analogy.
The industry is small, facets of it are making moves that should ultimately benefit all players, in particular those at the top. If all the players want is to play X-ball, then great, but once you have played Xball for a year, see if thats what you want from that point onwards. Europeans have had limited exposure to Xball, and so have not tired of it yet, or felt the financial side-effects.
The Xball league in the states has already split, owners have all but forfeited the huge sums some have paid for franchises, and a better, or more affordable, format is being investigated.
Nothing against the basic format concept, just the logistics of it, something that many players are not aware of, and probably don't care about anyway.

Anyway, it's not Oligopolistic, but I enjoyed the use of the word.

 

[chrismrgn]

yeah, until you realise the guy that invented it was called knickerbocker, as in glory.
Its illegal in the US, where it is known as carteling, and it is not what is actually happening, so would be a poor analogy.

Anyway, it's not Oligopolistic, but I enjoyed the use of the word.

For a market to be an oligopoly there does not need to be any cartel forming, (as if there was, seeing as paintball is such a large sports market, im sure the Competition Comission would have been involved) it is simply a mid point between a monopoly and perfect competition, where there are few companies competing in a market, which if you see it is companies such as Brass Eagle, PMI, and National you will see that it is infact very much like oligopolistic competition.

However onto your reply to the topic, i have to say that the logistics of an Xball format did slip my mind.