A must read - PA rule change for the 2005 season

[Steve Hancock]

Originally posted by manike
None of anyone knowing what is in that 'standard code'

You mean sneaky manufacturers could release a board with hidden cheats in it submit the code for approval and then only tell their factory/sponsored teams about the secret activation code. What are the chance that it wouldn't be leaked or accidentally stumbled apon by one of the many users. So there is no need to know what is in the standard code.

Originally posted by manike
None of catching hidden code in board.

Do you mean 0's and 1's not accessable by the interface? If so how would they be there in the first place or even have any effect on the board. Surely if the programable part of the board is programable from the interface it is readable from the interface, unless there is a seperate programable storage area, but in order for that to be accessed by the program which it would need to be in order to be used the programs code would have to be changed. And thus would be detected as different from the approved version.

Or do you mean hidden functions within the code, that couldn't be accessed without passwords or codes or couldn't be interpreted. Well they wouldn't need to be. The comparison between the codes would be a blind 0's and 1's check. If it was different from the approved codes there would be no need to prove any naughty functions, they should stilll get the penalty.

Admittedly i don't know much about the construction or composition of the boards so i may well be wrong about the above, could you help me out a little and clarify what you mean by hidden code.

BTW i'm gather that you work in the tech side of the industry, out of interest who do you work for. I'm guessing you may work with boards and the like, is that the case?

 

[Steve Hancock]

Originally posted by John C
May I add here there is also not a chance that the manufacturers would release the code any format. Compiled code can easily be decompiled back to something inteligable/stealable.

Is it not possible to read the 1's and 0's off the programable boards in any way?

EDIT (Genuine supprised question BTW. I'm not trying to contradict you guys, just trying to get the benifit of your better understanding)

 

[swave_gav]

leave the trigger bounce rules as they stand as its in the best interest of health and safty!

if the pa is looking 2 train refs they can be trained 2 not be over zelous when it comes 2 looking at markers, every electro marker will bounce at some point no mater how hard u try for it not 2 ,
but if it takes a marshal a full loader of paint 2 make a gun double fire 1nce does this gun really have an advantage erm ....no

with respect with what russ origonaly wanted the change for.... ppl not scared of handing there gun in at the begining of a game
if the marshals are all trained not 2 be over zelous russ will have ocomplished that.
ramp boreds i would say is a diferant ball game altogether

 

[John C]

Originally posted by Steve Hancock
Is it not possible to read the 1's and 0's off the programable boards in any way?

(Genuine supprised question BTW not trying to contradict you guys, just trying to get the benifit of your better understanding)

The programmer can choose to code protect the chip at program time.

This means you cant read the code off the chip.

If he does not enable code protect then the code can be read of the chip, it is really useful to leave this disabled when prototyping.

The only way to then disable code protect is to reprogram the chip, thus erasing the protected program.

 

[John C]

Originally posted by swave_gav
leave the trigger bounce rules as they stand as

You would be knackered then, the WAS board is one of the rampiest boards you can get!!!

 

[Gadget]

The only easily enforceable way to limit bps is to limit everyone to non-force fed loaders.

Make clear revvys with a specific paddle design compulsory and hey presto anyone trying to exceed about 13bps chokes or chops.

Easy for marshals to check and difficult to circumvent.

Of course every time this is suggested everyone goes off on one.....but I betcha it'd work.

Just legalising cheats because some people have them and other don't seems bloody daft to me.

 

[swave_gav]

i can set my markers so they dont bounce(well not much lol), it takes more than setting the debounce valve, u can also change setting so there is less kick in the gun so it dosnt set its self off

 

[manike]

Originally posted by Gadget
The only easily enforceable way to limit bps is to limit everyone to non-force fed loaders.

Make clear revvys with a specific paddle design compulsory and hey presto anyone trying to exceed about 13bps chokes or chops.

Easy for marshals to check and difficult to circumvent.

Of course every time this is suggested everyone goes off on one.....but I betcha it'd work.

That will only work if you don't mind everyone having different max rates of fire.

You will in effect give an advantage to one gun manufacturer over another.

You will also slow the rof down VERY significantly.

Also, before you could do that you would have to define the 'functionality of force feed loaders'.

Both the warp and Halo were developed and LEGAL under the old definition of 'gravity feed systems'. The only system that isn't is the Q-loader.

The ONLY way to maintain a standard measure and enforcement of a set ROF is at the gun.

 

[swave_gav]

how would the poor obtain a 15bps cap on there gun ?? they couldnt and would have 2 keep going at what they can shoot at but ppl with plenty pennys can go get a cap and ramp or bounce or what ever and shoot at 15 bps all day now the poor guy is at a disadvantage again??

 

[Liz]

Originally posted by manike

Both the warp and Halo were developed and LEGAL under the old definition of 'gravity feed systems'. The only system that isn't is the Q-loader.

Off topic I know, but it's always puzzled me how any loader that can keep feeding the marker even when upside down can be defined as pure gravity feed. By definition, gravity only pulls down towards the earth so balls being fed upwards away from the earth can't be feeding only by gravity, as they are moving in the opposite direction to the pull.