What's your opinion on Iraq?

[Mark/Static]

Slow down people, let's not confirm the notion to the rest of the world that we here in the US are just a bunch of beer swilling rednecks intent on making glass parking lots out of the middle east.
After 9/11 I had two schools of thought; one was fear of the wavering resolve of my fellow Americans when the body bags of our servicemen are shown on TV, or we drop a bomb on a terrorist training center that happened to have a school next door.
The other thought I had was the story of the old bull and the young bull. The young bull say's lets run down the hill and fu(k us some cows. The old bull says, lets walk down and fu(k them all.
Patience and determination. I have no illusion that the road we embarked on will be an easy one, but I believe we are left with no other choice.

 

[KillerOnion]

Good point

Originally posted by garycarrot


So what you are saying is, we need to stop them first, and then resolve the issues second.
I can live with that. But what makes us better than them?
If we MAKE them change the way in which they live, are we no better than them.?

Uh, perhaps you don't see their own point of view clearly. We live as we please and support others' rights to do so. They on the other hand want everyone to live as THEY prescribe and if not then not to live at all. THAT is the matter at hand. They have every right to live life as they should see fit but keep it to themselves. They don't. Read the Koran, wear a beard, don't eat pork, whatever is fine with us...it's the part about wiping out countries that don't believe what they do is the problem here. They want to do that. They (not Islam) teach and practice that. That is what keeps this going. We don't. Either that goes or they go. Apparently they have decided to attach themselves to it, and one of the two or both must go.

 

[soopaman luva]

ok lets c now what gives the usa the right to drop bombs on another country answer me that ??Where will it end ?r u trying for world domination ?? do u want to stick ur nose into every other country and try and control that country ? what about all the inocent people u have killed with your bombing ?? does the number of inocent people u have killed come to more than that of the people who died on 9/11 answer me that ?what gives u the right to kill inocent people,the number of people that have died from terrorists is a lot less than those that have died from the us bombing raids on countrys

 

[Mark/Static]

Originally posted by soopaman luva
ok lets c now what gives the usa the right to drop bombs on another country answer me that ??

Apparently you haven't read all or most of these posts. To answer your question, self defense.

Where will it end ?

Hopefully with Suddam, and other governments that support terrorism being deposed.

r u trying for world domination ??

No, I believe that was their goal.

do u want to stick ur nose into every other country and try and control that country ?

Only the ones that support terrorism aimed at us.

what about all the inocent people u have killed with your bombing ??

You mean the human shields those poor freedom fighters hid behind after they trained or funded the freedom fighters that flew airplanes into our buildings filled with us vile war mongers?

does the number of inocent people u have killed come to more than that of the people who died on 9/11 answer me that ?

You mean does the number of innocent people they intended to kill, equal the number of innocent people we unintentionally killed while trying to get the ones responsible? I haven't the slightest idea. What it comes down to is that the people of a totalitarian government are always the cannon fodder of their dictator. Was your outrage for the innocent the same for us a year ago? Will it be the same when they attack us again? Are you as concerned for the Iraqi Kurds and Shia that are brutalized daily at the hands of Suddam's regime?

what gives u the right to kill inocent people,the number of people that have died from terrorists is a lot less than those that have died from the us bombing raids on countrys

Kind of odd how one always precedes the other ain't it?

 

[headrock6]

stupidity at its finest

Originally posted by soopaman luva
ok lets c now what gives the usa the right to drop bombs on another country answer me that ??Where will it end ?r u trying for world domination ?? do u want to stick ur nose into every other country and try and control that country ? what about all the inocent people u have killed with your bombing ?? does the number of inocent people u have killed come to more than that of the people who died on 9/11 answer me that ?what gives u the right to kill inocent people,the number of people that have died from terrorists is a lot less than those that have died from the us bombing raids on countrys

It seems like a new Josef Goebbels has found his way into your country!!

Im not sure where your info is coming from but turn Al Jazeera off if thats the source and try opening a newspaper or newsgroups and educate yourself a little before saying some of the most ridiculous things ive seen on these boards

Now to the question at hand..What gives us the right to drop bombs on another country??
Hmmmm..Lets see..
Attempting to build a nuke which could fall into terrorists hands making Sept 11th look like a camp fire...

Stockpiling chemical weapons to shoot at neighbors..

Assasination plots on 2 presidents...
Brutal rape and torture of any who speak against them...

Violating every U.N. resolution that a country agreed to after invading a country and getting his ass kicked..

And world domination over who??Before Sept.11th the Taliban was doing fine for itself..North Korea and all these other rogue nations were pretty much undetered in whatever they were doing..Sept 11th ended any illusions that Americans could somehow float above the hatreds of the world..

Im actually done with this post...Id probably have an easier time explaining to my dog why terrorists and rogue nations are unhealthy for our world than getting my point across to you..Next time i respond to you is when i feel like your actually looking for answers and not trying to get a rise out of us...

 

[Justin Owen]

Supamon luva

Mr. Luva...

OK I was wrong. You ARE an idiot. Here are my answers to your, ummm, "questions":

1) Self-defense.
2) When the threat no longer exists.
3) No [while laughing]
4) No [laughing harder]
5) It's tragic.
6) I don't think so (but you apparently answer this question on your own later on...so where are your FACTS???)
7) See above answer(s)...and as I've said before, as our history in these conflicts demonstrates, we try very, very hard NOT to kill innocent people. In FACT (focus on that word) there are several instances in the recent Afghanistan conflict where bombing raids on probable Al-Quaida operatives were called off because there were numbers of probable innocents that would also have been killed. And we KNOW that we have missed Osama on more than one occasion DIRECTLY DUE to spending time on checks-and-balances that are in place specifically to avoid killing innocents. FACTS, sir.

It's obvious you are just trying to stir trouble with your response(s), as the nature of your comments demonstrates absolutely no forethought whatsoever, nor any resolve on your part to ascertain FACTS, and just barely rises above the type of remarks I would expect from an intelligent cabbage.

I tell ya' what...let's use the example of your family. Your neighbor barges into your house and beats your mom/wife/daughter, whatever, to a pulp...then leaves.

What do you do?

I see, I see. YOU will sit on your ass and do nothing.

A'ight then two days later he barges in again, this time batters another of your family, and gets away scot clean. Once again I suppose you're gonna sit on your ass and do nothing.

Thank God the majority of us are waaaaaaaay smarter and far more keen than yourself.

Your ridiculous, RIDICULOUS characterization of U.S. foreign policy is DIRECTLY DISPUTED by the FACTS, sir. No nation in HISTORY has possessed the power had by the United States, yet no nation in HISTORY with such power has EVER been as UNaggressive. We have never desired to expand our borders, or to dominate "foreign" peoples. All we have ever done IN OUR HISTORY is seek security and defend ourselves from those who would deny us that security.

GET YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR @SS.

Saddam Hussein has demonstrated himself to be a threat to worldwide security IN EVERY WAY IMAGINABLE. I can only hope that even someone as intellectually dim as yourself would not need to see a nuclear fire over his homeland before thinking that perhaps something should be done about this madman.

My thoughts mimic many of Mark's, Headrock's, etc...and in particular that last statement made by Headrock. I think it's far more likely you're just trying to stir up trouble than that you actually subscribe to the nonsense you spout. On that note, I too am finished discussing this with YOU.

Best to all...

~Justin Owen~

 

[TheRo0sTer]

Man I wish I had caught this one sooner! Too many pages to read! But I can say I don't really want the US to go in. But if Suddam has weapons of mass destruction maybe this the only solution to peace of mind for the Western world (This includes the UK). But maybe it will cause more problems. As I said before I really don't want this to happen again, too many of my friends and I will be seperated once again for countless day because of one mans rein and power or ability to bring new name Terrorist attacks with Nuclear Bombs. Man one of them would make life misserable for everyone not just the US especially with the Jet Stream headed right towards the UK.

 

[Buddha 3]

Dudes,

Strange how people can get so heated over political BS.
Personally I do feel a bit apprehensive about attacking Iraq. No matter how you put it, they are their own country, and we have nothing to say about them. On the other hand, I would feel a sense of relief if Saddam would catch a Paveway smartbomb in his morning cereal.
One of the reasons that is given for attacking Iraq is a bit hypocritical in my world. They have a weapon of mass destruction programme. Hmmm. So does the US. What gives NATO the right to decide which country is allowed nukes, and which one isn't? Don't give me that BS about 'their intention to use it, and their support of terrorist cells', because then the next country onto the flamegrill would be Pakistan, which, oddly enough, is now considered an ally. Let's face it, our only justification is that we are scared ****less of old moustache man. Works for me, but stop beating around the bush with rethoric.
In the early 80's we all thought that Iraq was a great place. Why? Simple, they fought against that 'cesspool of evil', Iran. So we gave them money, the French went over to build hangars, the Germans showed them how to build bunkers, and so on. But in the meantime they were working on a nuclear programme. Israel was worried sick about that (and for good reason), so decided to launch an airstrike against the Iraqi facilities. And knocked the Iraqi nuclear programme out. Ten years of work down the drain. At the time the whole world was shouting boo and hiss at Israel. I guess 20 years onwards we might want to send them some flowers with a 'sorry' note attached.
So let's get this straight. I'm not against taking out Saddam and his posse, but it does leave a bad taste in my mouth. There are other countries that flip the finger to UN resolutions bigtime, and they can get away with it! Yet they do not come up with these 'Doctor Evil' plots, so it's allowed. Bizarre.
Oh, and I remember someone saying that Sharon was not a terrorist. Maybe not now, but do you know that 60% of Israeli leadership was at one point wanted for terrorism? Dive into some British archives, and you'll find some wanted for terrorism posters for former Nobel peace prize winners.

We live in a strange world. There is no good and evil. There is only evil, and really really evil. Even the so called good guys aren't as good as they (we) pretend to be. The only reason humanity has been able to develop to the point where we are today, is because we are the most aggresive species on this planet.

 

[garycarrot]

Whats wrong with spotted dick?

Ask Mr Blair why we are still in Ireland, most English people would leave ASAP, but that would leave people there, who count themselves as English. So do we protect our own people or leave them to be attacked by the Irish?

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by Buddha 3
No matter how you put it, they are their own country, and we have nothing to say about them.

On the other hand, I would feel a sense of relief if Saddam would catch a Paveway smartbomb in his morning cereal.
One of the reasons that is given for attacking Iraq is a bit hypocritical in my world. They have a weapon of mass destruction programme. Hmmm. So does the US. What gives NATO the right to decide which country is allowed nukes, and which one isn't? Don't give me that BS about 'their intention to use it, and their support of terrorist cells',

because then the next country onto the flamegrill would be Pakistan, which, oddly enough, is now considered an ally. Let's face it, our only justification is that we are scared ****less of old moustache man. Works for me, but stop beating around the bush with rethoric.

In the early 80's we all thought that Iraq was a great place. Why? Simple, they fought against that 'cesspool of evil', Iran. So we gave them money, the French went over to build hangars, the Germans showed them how to build bunkers, and so on.

But in the meantime they were working on a nuclear programme. Israel was worried sick about that (and for good reason), so decided to launch an airstrike against the Iraqi facilities. And knocked the Iraqi nuclear programme out. Ten years of work down the drain. At the time the whole world was shouting boo and hiss at Israel. I guess 20 years onwards we might want to send them some flowers with a 'sorry' note attached.

When 99%+ of the people have no say whose country is it? Is it "theirs"? I don't think so.

If you would feel a sense of relief and western gov'ts are all scared what is everyone so afraid of? Doh! That if Saddam actually gets the capability he'll use it, right? First you deny the rationale and then just rephrase it.

Re: Pakistan. Prior to Afghanistan you might very well have been correct BUT the Pakistanis have made a series of choices that demonstrate a practical and pragmatic flexibility. They were concerned about radical Islamic influence (in Pakistan) and India and decided to opt for a different course than the one they had been on.
Does it all of a sudden make them "good" guys? Nope, it just changes the equation. (And if Saddam had thoroughly complied with the original resolutions and done what was asked of him without reservations odds are we'd all have been out of Iraq for awhile now.)

We all thought Iraq was a great place? C'mon, Jay, that's just silly. What we thought was an highly radicalized, unstable regime had taken control of Iran's 2 million man plus army and had announced their intent to use. Saddam simply proved to be a willing firewall.

What were western diplomats supposed to say?