Should Millenium Ban Ramping?
- Thread starter tiger jedi
- Start date
Due to the fact that the influences a rule-change has on a sport will vary according to the level of play, I can only pass comment on a relatively low level of play, or on hypothetical generalisations.
So in reference to my own experiences: Observing players in Div 1 and 2 of the PA this season, after ramping was introduced I saw them playing in a way that was more field-aware when they weren't having to concentrate on walking their trigger. People were communicating more, appeared to have less "tunnel vision", and were moving more. In short the other aspects of the game were enhanced. My experiences of playing in Div.4 of the PA were that with ramp it was far easier to run-and-gun meaning that movement came in to play more, making the games more interesting to watch, and from my point of view more enjoyable.
I can bring some evidence from my psychology degree as well. If you want to measure the level of someone’s concentration at different times during a task you ask them to continuously tap their finger and record the rate. It has been established that as they increase their concentration, (either in the depth of attention they give it or in the number of items they are attending to) the rate at which they can tap there fingers decreases. And further this correlation is highly resilient to any training affect.
This would lead me to expect that if a player's priority is fast firing then they would be sacrificing concentrating on the game.
While you may argue that semi only adds an element of skill to the game, I would reply that we can choose which elements of the game (and their associated skills) we wish to include, based on the effect they have on the game and its enjoyment and interest to the (elusive) spectators.
Oh and I agree that this is all irrelevant with the whole enforcement issue.
Gudman,
This might be a fair and defendable position if there was not inconsistency and subjectivity in the detection and measurement of bounce and even to a degree within the definition of it. If the player has no fixed, definitive and easily testable bench mark provided against which to test and set-up their equipment (such as a robot), then the only measure is a refs (admittedly in most cases informed) opinion. So they set there marker up test it against the only available and approved standard and take to the field of play, then due to the subjectivity of the testing a different ref decides differently. You mentioned that the 1st ref doesn't sanction the marker, well if there is no sanctioned benchmark for a player to set-up to, the chrono ref's opinion becomes the only official standard, a so in practice players have no choice but to take it as a standard.
You could say that they should just set there marker up with no bounce at all. Well with the correct apparatus (pendulums and ****) I could probably set up a tippman mech-trigger to bounce. Now obviously we aren't talking about that, but my point is that there is an undefined point (somewhere in between my freaky tippman experience and stupidly-runaway markers) that is the start of "bounce". As that is undefined and to a certain extent arbitrary, telling players none in fact means less that X, but you aren't telling them X! Okay you might say, they just need to be cautious and set up their triggers on the safe side. Imagine telling F1 teams that “your car can’t be too close to the ground” “how close is too close?” “Just use your judgement, that’s what the refs will be doing, just set up on the cautious side”… see what I’m saying?
i aint really got a opinion on this ill play 25 balls ramping or 15 i dont care but one point you could use against it is saftey.
i dont kno if this has been mentioned allready but at campaign cup one of our team got knocked out due to a ramping gun at point blank range.
i dont kno if this has been mentioned allready but at campaign cup one of our team got knocked out due to a ramping gun at point blank range.
You can't say however that had the gun not been ramping he would't have been knocked out anyway ?? (Wasn't there so excuse if it was so OTT) we had a simaler incident in the PA but the player was only hit twice in the head (albeit ramping) and a few times elsewhere. Even without ramping he would probably have been hit twice put it was the placment (temple) that was criticle not the volume !
And if what is said on here ref NPPL is to be true then 15 ramping is still less than 20 semi in cheat mode !!!
If there is to be a cap on 'safety' ground it need to be irespective of mode and less than 15 !!
That was bad but is totally capable of happening with semi even on a non cheating gun.
I had my nose burst through my mask from the amount of balls which hit the mask at point blank range just cos the person kept firing when i mugged them an there gun was pointing exactly where my head came round an i was close to losing consiousness i could feel my head going light and my eyes spin an it was just my mask that took the hits not my actual head if i took them in the head im pretty sure it would have floored me.
The gun was tested afterwards an it was true semi.
At the end of the day we are playing a dangerous game we play it knowing the risks no matter what mode the gun is in they are the same risks a player can just keep firing if they want to with semi or ramping or can stop when they want to. Its all a matter of when they chose to take there finger off the trigger.
My view, ramping is bad, uncapped semi is better and prob capped semi would be best (maybe a 18 bps cap)
As for the checking for capped rampers, did anyone get checked at Campaign this year? Not once was any of our teams markers checked, we could happlily have been 30bps ramping, with added velocity ramps, the full works.
Surely if this technology exists every marker should be checked at every game much like chronograph checks, and also performed on the filed throughout the day.
The argument that the 15bps ramping rules are enforced, may well be true for the top USA teams, but hey why the hell should us brits be the same, when we cant be arsed to check what we implement!
**** i hate agreeing with robbo
As for the checking for capped rampers, did anyone get checked at Campaign this year? Not once was any of our teams markers checked, we could happlily have been 30bps ramping, with added velocity ramps, the full works.
Surely if this technology exists every marker should be checked at every game much like chronograph checks, and also performed on the filed throughout the day.
The argument that the 15bps ramping rules are enforced, may well be true for the top USA teams, but hey why the hell should us brits be the same, when we cant be arsed to check what we implement!
**** i hate agreeing with robbo
Try defining gravity feed. Besides, force feed loaders are a reliability issue - gravity feed is bad because it negatively impacts reliable operation. Sometimes you'll get a shot when you pull the trigger, sometimes not.
You either have to allow ramping and have a means of enforcing it (PACT timers etc) or be sem-auto only and have certified boards. Those are the only two options other than having rules on paper nobody has to follow.
You either have to allow ramping and have a means of enforcing it (PACT timers etc) or be sem-auto only and have certified boards. Those are the only two options other than having rules on paper nobody has to follow.
Originally posted by FAMINE
**** i hate agreeing with robbo
Don't fight it duuuuude, it's an inevitable outcome of people becoming wiser as they get older...if you don't agree with me now then wait a while longer and life will eventually equip you with sufficient intelligence to see the light