Oooooh!! Dynasty FA Scandal!!

[Wadidiz]

Originally posted by Robbo
If we wait any longer, we may find the sight of an eyeball whizzing past a judge's head may well be the pressure the manufacturers might end up responding to.
If this is the case, then EVERY SINGLE player out there who decides to designer cheat their guns is responsible.
Think about where the dynamics are for the reluctance of the industry to grasp this nettle and a fair proportion of the responsibility lies at the feet of the players who feel they need to win sooo much they need to compromise people's safety and the rules.

I definitely agree with Robbo here. Well-said. I would like to see uniformity regarding penalties for serious things like this and to see the major leagues honor each other's suspensions.

I want to qualify that what I say here is an opinion and by no means an "official" statement:

The more I think about it the more I become convinced that we have to cap the rate of fire AT THE HOPPER.

This would be by far the simplest to execute and monitor. It would suck that the hopper manufacturers would have to be the ones to bite the bitter pill but I think it would be much simpler than having the shell-game of approved boards, tamper-seals, expensive robots and employing an army of highly-trained scrutineers.

Others, like Nick B, have suggested a cap of around 15 BPS; this is the best way to do it.

Then the hoppers could get their approval as complying to the capped ROF and everyone would quickly become aware of which models were allowed.

Then the hopper manufacturers would have to shift their focus away from forcing-feeding higher ROF and concentrate on other things.

The question would then be, should we allow more than one shot per trigger cycle but still not allow full auto? I think so. And somehow we have to make sure that shots stop instantly when the trigger is released.

We also would have to clamp down on increasing velocity.

No matter what we do there will be resistance. From gun-makers, hopper manufacturers, suppliers of paintballs and the players who choose to spend money on unsafe and unfair cheating.

But we have to do something radical NOW.

Steve

 

[Wadidiz]

Steve

Originally posted by Nick Brockdorff
It wouldn't be enough to approve hoppers - at cheatsoftware can be made for those too !

We need a device to measure ROF on each player during play....... I actually know someone working on it presently... and will let you know what the results are.

Nick

I hope that dog you're talking about really hunts.

Otherwise, I would be satisfied at the moment to go with VL Revvies, Ricochets and all Halos except Bs, even if some go slightly over 15 BPS.

Steve

 

[Robbo]

Just supposing, the guys on this site (or any site for that matter) come up with the ideal plan to nullify these cheats and it involves manufacturers modifying thier production runs, leagues instituting a more pro active philosophy toward desinger cheats, league rules committees amending their rules to have stricter penalties and amending rule books to accomodate new procedures and penalties...just supposing we have all the answers....how do we make it happen ?
What pressure do we apply and what do we do if the process is too slow or refused?

It's one thing coming up with answers to problems, a totally different problem when we try to put those answers into practice especially when it involves other people having to do what's right

 

[Wadidiz]

Simple Pete

Originally posted by Nick Brockdorff
Give paintball to me !

- I'll sort it out then



Nick

Never!

Give it TO ME!

Brockdorff can be on my governing council, if he behaves!

 

[Wadidiz]

Originally posted by Robbo
It's one thing coming up with answers to problems, a totally different problem when we try to put those answers into practice especially when it involves other people having to do what's right

In Millennium, we just have to figure out exactly what rules and procedures we need to implement as quickly as possible. I see a definite willingness to get this area under control. Probably with clearer, tougher rules, a robot, scrutineers and video recording for the time being.

As far as the hopper ROF limitation idea? I don't see any major league embracing that idea with open arms.

Steve

 

[Robbo]

Simple Pete

Originally posted by Nick Brockdorff
Give paintball to me !

- I'll sort it out then



Nick

But that's my point, we both could but would never get the opportunity, so what are we actually left with, lobbying?, advising?, scaremongering?, boycotting?, appealing on a moral basis? (hahhaha)......

I think we need to start with tournament regulation and if we can come up with a set of regs that is fair and rational, then we need to get them introduced into the rule-book ASAP.

No point in waiting for the industry or players to get an attack of the guilts, we need to do it at the front end and force player and industry alike that it just ain't worth the aggravation or risk.

 

[Wadidiz]

Re: Simple Pete

Originally posted by Robbo
I think we need to start with tournament regulation and if we can come up with a set of regs that is fair and rational, then we need to get them introduced into the rule-book ASAP.

No point in waiting for the industry or players to get an attack of the guilts, we need to do it at the front end and force player and industry alike that it just ain't worth the aggravation or risk.

Totally agreed! It certainly makes sense for at least NPPL and Millennium to work out the wording and practice so they're the same.

What kind of tests, rules and penalties would you suggest?

Steve

 

[Robbo]

Re: Re: Simple Pete

Originally posted by Wadidiz
Totally agreed! It certainly makes sense for at least NPPL and Millennium to work out the wording and practice so they're the same.

What kind of tests, rules and penalties would you suggest?

Steve

I will start at the back end with penalties, u get caught once, it's a six month ban minimum, u get done twice, it's bye byes.

Rules?
Any more than one shot per intentional trigger pull that is not aided in any way mechanically will be deemed a cheating gun.

Tests?
I think this area needs a lot more debate and Manike's input as well as a few others like Dave Zinkham (NPPL rules committee guy) is crucial I think.

This is a start.

 

[H]

The whole limiting hopper speed by sanctioning designs is rather missing the point.

The problem seems to be the fact that markers are shooting more than one ball per trigger pull, capping the BPS through the hopper would not prevent this possible safety issue. A full auto marker is still dangerous at a hopper controlled 15bps.

Also a hopper cap would not prevent electro gun cheats such as the ramping of dwell and therefore velocity when shooting the marker at a sustained rhythm. These are the scary cheats, one which risk the safety of everyone, players, refs and spectators.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The only way of preventing technology abuse in paintball markers would be to take the controls away from the teams. Standardised marker designs, sanctioned by the sports ruling bodies working with manufacturers. As soon as u let teams mess around with their markers you are unbalancing the playing field.

Maybe this solution will come to fruition, but i can't see it happening until the rules committees pull their arrogant fingers out of their arses and put their personal interests aside to sort the mess out. At the very least, those found cheating shouldn't be given an inch. I don't care if they are Dynasty, Nexus or ZombiePaintEaters from god knows where. All levels treated equally by guys who are truly independent from the teams taking part.

 

[Wadidiz]

Originally posted by TheBroz
....i can't see it happening until the rules committees pull their arrogant fingers out of their arses and put their personal interests aside to sort the mess out.

You have some interesting points but...

I didn't know my fingers were in the location you mention and what are my personal issues?

Back to subject:

I hope a device like Nick mentioned is on the way. Maybe all markers will have to fitted by a device hung on the muzzle that signals or even shuts down the gun whenever allowed ROF or FPS is exceeded.

Anything is possible with technology, I suppose.

Steve