NPPL bps Cap Revisited...
- Thread starter Manning26
- Start date
In Furb's defense one must remember he is one of the fast fingers crowd so is naturally resistant.
If one were to check thru the scores one would discover quite a few minus 100 scores chalked up throughout the prelims. It would be interesting to know if they were able to "prove" the guns illegal or did the players or teams involved fail the new don't touch anything or you're guilty rules.
Either way I watched--literally--hours of Pro games on the Empire field Saturday afternoon whilst waiting for the afternoon session to finish and because we needed to walk that field after the session ended. Numerous teams, including Infamous, were using plainly illegal markers. I could hear the modes kick in. Hell, anyone could hear the modes kick in which is likely why some of them apparently ended up visiting Robbie the Robot.
Nor was it limited to top teams. Just what percentage of guns were probably illegal I won't venture to guess but it wasn't and isn't an insignificant number. Of course there are lots of ways of being defined as illegal, too, and most were likely of the add a few shots when being railed on hard variety.
(A brief story--saw one guy on a Div 2 team playing the Chronic field using an Impy of some sort get caught at the end of the game with a runaway gun and the sad thing was that during the game the gun was pretty slow 'cus his technique was so abominable. Clearly it had been set-up on the edge of legality and slipped over but it hadn't given the guy or his team any advantage at all. Just cost them a game and enough penalty points to likely keep them from moving on.)
If I could tell y'all about some of the sneaky stuff in some of the markers provided by manufacturers without risking compromising sources I would but I'm not sure I can. The reality is it's out there and it's being institutionalized to a significant degree.
Still, if the majority of the players are fine with it, it's okay by me. After all, they're the ones paying to play. At some point though the NPPL will have to control the Pro level playing field one way or another if they truly expect to ultimately make a marketable sport out of their brand of paintball.
To Beaker--Re: reffing Honestly I didn't think it was particulary worse than other NPPL events I've attended. The issues that were getting most of the players area complaints during the event was the overzealous calls, in the estimation of some players, by certain refs.
The legit concerns were the fields that had some complex clutter that required refs to get into the thick of and work hard to officiate. The Angel field comes to mind. Lots of hits lost there as refs worked mostly from the perimeter. JT could have been more problematic if more teams had attacked the center and the Empire field's dorito lane between the snake and the center line was a tough spot.
If one were to check thru the scores one would discover quite a few minus 100 scores chalked up throughout the prelims. It would be interesting to know if they were able to "prove" the guns illegal or did the players or teams involved fail the new don't touch anything or you're guilty rules.
Either way I watched--literally--hours of Pro games on the Empire field Saturday afternoon whilst waiting for the afternoon session to finish and because we needed to walk that field after the session ended. Numerous teams, including Infamous, were using plainly illegal markers. I could hear the modes kick in. Hell, anyone could hear the modes kick in which is likely why some of them apparently ended up visiting Robbie the Robot.
Nor was it limited to top teams. Just what percentage of guns were probably illegal I won't venture to guess but it wasn't and isn't an insignificant number. Of course there are lots of ways of being defined as illegal, too, and most were likely of the add a few shots when being railed on hard variety.
(A brief story--saw one guy on a Div 2 team playing the Chronic field using an Impy of some sort get caught at the end of the game with a runaway gun and the sad thing was that during the game the gun was pretty slow 'cus his technique was so abominable. Clearly it had been set-up on the edge of legality and slipped over but it hadn't given the guy or his team any advantage at all. Just cost them a game and enough penalty points to likely keep them from moving on.)
If I could tell y'all about some of the sneaky stuff in some of the markers provided by manufacturers without risking compromising sources I would but I'm not sure I can. The reality is it's out there and it's being institutionalized to a significant degree.
Still, if the majority of the players are fine with it, it's okay by me. After all, they're the ones paying to play. At some point though the NPPL will have to control the Pro level playing field one way or another if they truly expect to ultimately make a marketable sport out of their brand of paintball.
To Beaker--Re: reffing Honestly I didn't think it was particulary worse than other NPPL events I've attended. The issues that were getting most of the players area complaints during the event was the overzealous calls, in the estimation of some players, by certain refs.
The legit concerns were the fields that had some complex clutter that required refs to get into the thick of and work hard to officiate. The Angel field comes to mind. Lots of hits lost there as refs worked mostly from the perimeter. JT could have been more problematic if more teams had attacked the center and the Empire field's dorito lane between the snake and the center line was a tough spot.
Which is precisely the point, Dale. Over and over the refs thought maybe something funny was going on but couldn't prove it. Multiple that by enough teams, players and guns and you have a serious problem.
1. Know your enemy, grasshopper - you really need to get some Sun Tzu in yo head Furbs.
2. Nah, from what I understand they don't have to be sophisticated at all...this whole war on BPS is like tha war on drugs in soooo many ways; people are paying to play, tha authorities are encouraging misbehaviour with one hand and slapping people upside tha head with tha other, and it's not winnable.
That aside, it's great. No, really...
And the PSP modes are the answer? I think not. The incident involving Final Justice at Orlando might be used to illustrate that point, Paul.
Elsewhere I've heard rumblings of cheaters attempting to bypass the 15bps cap that the PSP imposes, and on-the-street I hear alot of guys are using the PSP Compliant modes in the CFOA and getting away with it...
The fact remains that in any equipment based sport, equipment-based cheats are going to be a major problem, and even in the vaunted NASCAR that some seem to champion as an example of purity within a given sport is still plagued with overbored engines, frame rails storing extra fuel, and all manner of shenanigans.
While as a paint distributor I salivate at Lambini's solution, as a player I'd prefer not to face or deal out unrestricted F/A.
The facts are that there is no easy solution and the various acronyms have their own solution, none of which are the best. Increasing the budgets of those that police the various leagues seems to be mandatory at this point, but I won't hold my breath on that happening. Perhaps giving them a catchy name like "The Fun Police" will garner them the publicity and attention they deserve.
As for the reffing, I did hear some complaints about the crew on the Angel field, but nothing I'd consider out of the norm for a major event. Everyone bitches about the reffing, called for or not. It's a thankless job they have.
There is, if you follow my simple rules:
1. Uncapped FA
2. Maximum of 6 pods per player
There ya go...manageable, enforceable, won't make the game a lanefest etcetcetc.
As Cow is fond of saying, and I happen to again with His Bovineness, without clearly laid out, enforceable rules, there is no sport - this whole gun issue in all tha leagues makes a mockery of sport. I know for a stone cold fact that one Pro baller went out unwittingly with an illegal gun in a game at tampa.
Now this guy was 100% honest and as soon as tha game finished got tha gun sorted. Now the gun wasn't tested or spotted by refs and there was no hue and cry, and our innocently guilty party was mortified.
But that event affected tha outcome of the game - how could it not? It's like a quarterback being given a bionic arm...
I thought there was more gun-cheating there than I saw last season. Dynasty's guns clearly go full-auto on the break, and this was never more evident than in thier game on the NPPL field against Infamous where 4 or 5 guys got hit on the break. Do I feel sorry for Infamous - No - because I saw thier guns cheating also, although maybe not with such effect as the Dynasty 'break-out mode'.
As for the refs; much better in my opinion. Beaker, you weren't there, so you are unqualified to comment on it, even in a 'he said/I heard/he told me' kind of way. You normally have more sense.
Were they the perfect officials? Of course not, but they did thier job well. It was great to see Boogie out there too. He's a great ref and makes a difference to refs around him too.
So for 2c worth of Intheno opinion:
Gun Cheating - worse
Reffing - better
Standard of play in Pro and Semi-Pro - the highest I have seen and some of the best paintball games I have ever watched. This last thing is probably what left the most lasting impression on me though.
and the magnet in the glove theory - They have been saying that about LaSoya since 1998. It wasn't true then and it isn't now.
as for FA - I would definitely prefer uncapped to capped, and unlimited bullets too. Never limit the bullets. Thats rule number one.
The fact is though that this will not happen this season, if at all, so all the speculation and conjecture is redundant. The rules are known, they are not going to be adapted/changed mid-season. I am sure there will be more involved efforts to catch people cheating with thier guns, but the rules are not changing till the end of the season. This shouldn't stop people from continually posting about what the NPPL should 'switch to' of course, but it does seem a little bit like a waste of time to me...
One of the interesting things for me is that I know that quite a few of the people that post here about cheating are fully aware of the way that these top teams are getting away with it, and do it themselves. They know the cheat codes and the panic buttons, but given the choice to send the NPPL an e-mail explaining how to catch the culprits, speaking to the ultimate at the event to 'mark his card', or coming on here to chastise the league and the refs for not doing anything about it, they choose the last option, presumably because the former options would be 'snitching', and might cost them 'cool-points'.
This hypocracy is rife in paintball and is one of the major things holding the sport back. Stop bitching if you are one of the many who can do something about it. Just keep your mouths shut and keep cheating, or fess up.
As for the refs; much better in my opinion. Beaker, you weren't there, so you are unqualified to comment on it, even in a 'he said/I heard/he told me' kind of way. You normally have more sense.
Were they the perfect officials? Of course not, but they did thier job well. It was great to see Boogie out there too. He's a great ref and makes a difference to refs around him too.
So for 2c worth of Intheno opinion:
Gun Cheating - worse
Reffing - better
Standard of play in Pro and Semi-Pro - the highest I have seen and some of the best paintball games I have ever watched. This last thing is probably what left the most lasting impression on me though.
and the magnet in the glove theory - They have been saying that about LaSoya since 1998. It wasn't true then and it isn't now.
as for FA - I would definitely prefer uncapped to capped, and unlimited bullets too. Never limit the bullets. Thats rule number one.
The fact is though that this will not happen this season, if at all, so all the speculation and conjecture is redundant. The rules are known, they are not going to be adapted/changed mid-season. I am sure there will be more involved efforts to catch people cheating with thier guns, but the rules are not changing till the end of the season. This shouldn't stop people from continually posting about what the NPPL should 'switch to' of course, but it does seem a little bit like a waste of time to me...
One of the interesting things for me is that I know that quite a few of the people that post here about cheating are fully aware of the way that these top teams are getting away with it, and do it themselves. They know the cheat codes and the panic buttons, but given the choice to send the NPPL an e-mail explaining how to catch the culprits, speaking to the ultimate at the event to 'mark his card', or coming on here to chastise the league and the refs for not doing anything about it, they choose the last option, presumably because the former options would be 'snitching', and might cost them 'cool-points'.
This hypocracy is rife in paintball and is one of the major things holding the sport back. Stop bitching if you are one of the many who can do something about it. Just keep your mouths shut and keep cheating, or fess up.
I would agree with ITN. I didnt see any reffing problems, and thought that the standard of judging in the NPPL has been consistently good so far this year.
And some of the guns i saw.......
And some of the guns i saw.......
1. Then do you not think that if they know these gun are doing it, tha NPPL should allow judges to make subjective calls? I.E. Boogie sees a guy go FA, knows he's gone FA, but also knows that once he gets that gun over tha robot it won't get caught, so why not empower him to make the call and yank tha armband anyway?
2. Of course he can and you know he can. 'Hey, ITN, you were there - I heard tha reffing was great, what did you think?' See, I can do it too...
3. I agree, I wouldn't really cap tha bullets or tha guns, but it's a possible solution for scaredy cats.
4. Course it's not a waste of time - many good ideas have come to pass after starting life getting batted back n forth on message boards.
5. Boom. You is 100% right on there brother.