Mill Series 2005
- Thread starter Just Curious
- Start date
I have heard a piece of information re the Euro NPPL events, I hope its only a rumor.
Although there are more than 2 Euro events that carry full NPPL points only 2 Euro scores will be allowed to count towards the series total.
So if the Jags decide to do Div1 NPPL we will be forced to do a minimum of 3 stateside events to make up the 5 scores. My problem with that is the US teams may not have to travel to Europe at all.
This obviously puts a huge financial pressure onto the Euro teams that (usually) have a smaller budget than the U.S ones competing for the same points.
If the NPPL is really trying to market itself as a world series, can the rest of the Paintball playing world (Europe) at least have a level playing field on the qualifying event issue.
A possible solution would be (depending on your geographical location) Either 3 U.S events and two Euro, or 2 U.S events and 3 Euro. Or the most sane and therefore most unlikely option, you let the teams choose which events they attend!
I know the last option will bring cries of Euro teams could do more "easy point" events, but they are open to U.S teams as well. The smart U.S teams would realize this and come over and the imbalance would even itself out
Over to you Baca and ITN.
Although there are more than 2 Euro events that carry full NPPL points only 2 Euro scores will be allowed to count towards the series total.
So if the Jags decide to do Div1 NPPL we will be forced to do a minimum of 3 stateside events to make up the 5 scores. My problem with that is the US teams may not have to travel to Europe at all.
This obviously puts a huge financial pressure onto the Euro teams that (usually) have a smaller budget than the U.S ones competing for the same points.
If the NPPL is really trying to market itself as a world series, can the rest of the Paintball playing world (Europe) at least have a level playing field on the qualifying event issue.
A possible solution would be (depending on your geographical location) Either 3 U.S events and two Euro, or 2 U.S events and 3 Euro. Or the most sane and therefore most unlikely option, you let the teams choose which events they attend!
I know the last option will bring cries of Euro teams could do more "easy point" events, but they are open to U.S teams as well. The smart U.S teams would realize this and come over and the imbalance would even itself out
Over to you Baca and ITN.
Thats exactly the same as it was last season Chuck.
I dont see it as a problem. I cant see why the NPPL would allow all 5 event scores to come from Europe, as the Euro events are far easier to score points in than the NPPL due to the quality of the teams there.
If a team do not do at least 3 events in the NPPL USA events then do they really deserve to be included in the league?
It is expensive, and over the budget of most teams, but it is manageable. We played 4 NPPL's in the States, and they are definately worth the extra money to get to. Whilst flights cost more, hotels and car hire, and other expenses are slightly less than Euro prices.
Sam,
read and digest my post properly! I'm suggesting 3 euro scores and 2 U.S for teams that play in Europe. Flip that for the U.S teams.
Also remember that I'm coming at this from a Div 1 perspective and our budgets are significantly less than most Pro teams. Also most teams do not have such a benovolant owner as yours does, If you did not have the input from Russ do you think 4 U.S events would still be possible?
Chuck
read and digest my post properly! I'm suggesting 3 euro scores and 2 U.S for teams that play in Europe. Flip that for the U.S teams.
Also remember that I'm coming at this from a Div 1 perspective and our budgets are significantly less than most Pro teams. Also most teams do not have such a benovolant owner as yours does, If you did not have the input from Russ do you think 4 U.S events would still be possible?
Chuck
I did read your post, and understood it perfectly. I just dont see that there is a problem that needs a solution.
From the NPPL point of view, they have the best league in the world. People want to play that league, which leaves the NPPL with all the power
There are a few reasons i can think of that would prevent the NPPL from allowing what you suggest:
1. If they allow Euro teams to play more Euro events than Stateside events in order to gain a series placing then they are giving up thousands of dollars in lost earnings (entry fee paid elsewhere)
2. They would come under fire from the majority of their teams by allowing points from the 'easier' league to count. Its the same thing in the MS when teams can win the series by using Reffing points.
I appreciate that it is expensive. This season has cost me more money than i care to think about (£1000's!
). But the fact that it is expensive to go over to the States and play the NPPL is not a reason for allowing more Euro teams a chance to play the league.
Input from people on my team is not relevent to this.
From the NPPL point of view, they have the best league in the world. People want to play that league, which leaves the NPPL with all the power
There are a few reasons i can think of that would prevent the NPPL from allowing what you suggest:
1. If they allow Euro teams to play more Euro events than Stateside events in order to gain a series placing then they are giving up thousands of dollars in lost earnings (entry fee paid elsewhere)
2. They would come under fire from the majority of their teams by allowing points from the 'easier' league to count. Its the same thing in the MS when teams can win the series by using Reffing points.
I appreciate that it is expensive. This season has cost me more money than i care to think about (£1000's!
). But the fact that it is expensive to go over to the States and play the NPPL is not a reason for allowing more Euro teams a chance to play the league.Input from people on my team is not relevent to this.
Yeah, vegas was nice
I dont know what i'll do next year... hoping to play some!
time will tell....
It's also a time burden Sam.
You also need to factor in that Sponsorship is not necessarily exportable across continents. Follow the money trail on the sponsorship deals and with the exception of anything from WDP, it generally eminates from the States. What mileage would say NPS / Draxxus get in sponsoring a Euro Team, especially one that is going to be a whipping boy in the top league, when they can effectively spend their sponsorship bucks closer to home and for less?
This will force a probable contraction in the in-industry sponsorship available to Euro teams, or at the least make it more difficult to come by. If I was a Paint Sponsor, why would I give free bullets to the lesser teams? With the Pro focus now firmly back in the US, the sponsors can get better value by supporting firstly more competitive domestic teams and secondly Paintball team allegiances are not a s geographical as people think. People don't buy Shockers cos Tigers use them, but they do because Dynasty do. Same thing with bullets, no one cares what the losers shoot, only the winners or instantly recognisable teams. Teams who have not seriously considered their brand image are pretty much screwed, as there is very little fiscal incentive to sponsor Euro teams, unless they have embraced this concept.
You see 2004 wasn't about only being good enough to gain Pro qualification, you needed to be concentrating on the Collie Green Linguini's too. Historically you have advocated sponsorship contraction, those chickens are coming home to roost now sunshine. In my opinion some teams are living in cloud la la land if they think they can max it up NPPL Pro stylee, they should have been looking at Div 1 instead. It is oft better to Reign in Hell than Serve in Heaven, and if the TV comes you likely get better exposure this way anyway.
I agree that US events may not cost much more than a Euro, but what if the help pie has suddenly gotten smaller, or more difficult to get a slice? It ain't going to be easy, even for the "Pro's". If you want to play you'll have to find the money and the NPPL isn't likely to alienate it's main customer base and competitive Mkt for the sake of the European teams. I mean what else are the Euro's going to play anyway........
So it is going to be very hard for Euro teams, but in fairness, they shoulda seen it coming.
You also need to factor in that Sponsorship is not necessarily exportable across continents. Follow the money trail on the sponsorship deals and with the exception of anything from WDP, it generally eminates from the States. What mileage would say NPS / Draxxus get in sponsoring a Euro Team, especially one that is going to be a whipping boy in the top league, when they can effectively spend their sponsorship bucks closer to home and for less?
This will force a probable contraction in the in-industry sponsorship available to Euro teams, or at the least make it more difficult to come by. If I was a Paint Sponsor, why would I give free bullets to the lesser teams? With the Pro focus now firmly back in the US, the sponsors can get better value by supporting firstly more competitive domestic teams and secondly Paintball team allegiances are not a s geographical as people think. People don't buy Shockers cos Tigers use them, but they do because Dynasty do. Same thing with bullets, no one cares what the losers shoot, only the winners or instantly recognisable teams. Teams who have not seriously considered their brand image are pretty much screwed, as there is very little fiscal incentive to sponsor Euro teams, unless they have embraced this concept.
You see 2004 wasn't about only being good enough to gain Pro qualification, you needed to be concentrating on the Collie Green Linguini's too. Historically you have advocated sponsorship contraction, those chickens are coming home to roost now sunshine. In my opinion some teams are living in cloud la la land if they think they can max it up NPPL Pro stylee, they should have been looking at Div 1 instead. It is oft better to Reign in Hell than Serve in Heaven, and if the TV comes you likely get better exposure this way anyway.
I agree that US events may not cost much more than a Euro, but what if the help pie has suddenly gotten smaller, or more difficult to get a slice? It ain't going to be easy, even for the "Pro's". If you want to play you'll have to find the money and the NPPL isn't likely to alienate it's main customer base and competitive Mkt for the sake of the European teams. I mean what else are the Euro's going to play anyway........
So it is going to be very hard for Euro teams, but in fairness, they shoulda seen it coming.
I have advocated sponsorship contraction in the past as a means of allowing Euro teams a better chance of achieving parity with the Americans through increased training and increased resources. I think that paintball will fall into line with other sports where the big companies pur their sponsorship money/product into the larger teams who are playing in the leagues with the exposure. Campaions League Football is a huge appeal for prespective sponsors when budgets are deliberated over.
I think that for the 5 Euro teams that managed to qualify for the NPPL 2k5, Joy, Ton Ton Acyd, Nexus, Tigers and Shock there will be an increase in resources and backing. Obviously that will mean that smaller teams will be given less by their sponsors, but that is sport. It happens the world over, and will continue to happen.
I do not think that it would be unreasonable for the NPPL to state that no Euro events were to count. That way there would be an equal chance for every team that entered.
I realise that some teams do not have multi regional sponsorship, maybe it is shortsightedness of a company not to allow sponsorship to cover the best series in the world. Or maybe it is that they want to keep their products in specific area, but these details are easy to determine when sponsorship contracts are being discussed between captains and the industry. If a company will not back you to do what you want then look elsewhere. Obviously it is not as easy as that sometimes, and compromises must be made.
I think that for the 5 Euro teams that managed to qualify for the NPPL 2k5, Joy, Ton Ton Acyd, Nexus, Tigers and Shock there will be an increase in resources and backing. Obviously that will mean that smaller teams will be given less by their sponsors, but that is sport. It happens the world over, and will continue to happen.
I do not think that it would be unreasonable for the NPPL to state that no Euro events were to count. That way there would be an equal chance for every team that entered.
I realise that some teams do not have multi regional sponsorship, maybe it is shortsightedness of a company not to allow sponsorship to cover the best series in the world. Or maybe it is that they want to keep their products in specific area, but these details are easy to determine when sponsorship contracts are being discussed between captains and the industry. If a company will not back you to do what you want then look elsewhere. Obviously it is not as easy as that sometimes, and compromises must be made.
1. If they allow Euro teams to play more Euro events than Stateside events in order to gain a series placing then they are giving up thousands of dollars in lost earnings (entry fee paid elsewhere)
What lost revenue? the entry would be paid into an NPPL euro event, the teams would still have to do a minimum of 5 events all of which are NPPL.
The lost revenue will happen when we are forced to play a min of three of those events in America. The cost of this plus 2 Euro events will make competing in the series impossible for the majority of Euro Div 1 teams. Not only the cost of events is higher but you have to factor in the extra holiday required which adds yet more cost!
I have done the Math of taking the team to the U.S and I do not think the players on the squad can afford 3 events! It's that simple. If we can not afford it on our Sponsorship package how are the teams with less of a budget going to be able to afford it? The lost revenue will be from teams that opt out of doing the events because of the financial pressure(Euro open Xball an example)
Euro Div1 teams have got game, Hellwood have just proved that in San Diego it would be a shame to hobble the talent over here because of the pro U.S biased qualification system.
Come on PP/ NPPL, do the right thing and give us Euros a fair crack at it!
The more Euro teams you can get committed to the whole series the better. It adds validity to the world series and In the end just makes good business sense.
In short Sam i'm trying to make the point that we shouldn't be penalised for living over here. Nature has allready done that with our weather( Boogie would probably disagree)
ITN you are floating about on here somewhere what do you think?
Chuck
What lost revenue? the entry would be paid into an NPPL euro event, the teams would still have to do a minimum of 5 events all of which are NPPL.
The lost revenue will happen when we are forced to play a min of three of those events in America. The cost of this plus 2 Euro events will make competing in the series impossible for the majority of Euro Div 1 teams. Not only the cost of events is higher but you have to factor in the extra holiday required which adds yet more cost!
I have done the Math of taking the team to the U.S and I do not think the players on the squad can afford 3 events! It's that simple. If we can not afford it on our Sponsorship package how are the teams with less of a budget going to be able to afford it? The lost revenue will be from teams that opt out of doing the events because of the financial pressure(Euro open Xball an example)
Euro Div1 teams have got game, Hellwood have just proved that in San Diego it would be a shame to hobble the talent over here because of the pro U.S biased qualification system.
Come on PP/ NPPL, do the right thing and give us Euros a fair crack at it!
The more Euro teams you can get committed to the whole series the better. It adds validity to the world series and In the end just makes good business sense.
In short Sam i'm trying to make the point that we shouldn't be penalised for living over here. Nature has allready done that with our weather( Boogie would probably disagree)
ITN you are floating about on here somewhere what do you think?
Chuck
1 It would be lost revenue if the events will be like they were last year, and merely partner events. PP saw none of the money ( i dont think) from Toulouse, Germany, Malaga or Madrid.
2. They wont be able to, but that is what happens in sports across the world. Novice teams have to win and keep winning in order to pull in the money.
3. There is no pro usa bias. The NPPL cannot help that airline tickets are expensive, or that we live so far away. Its not as if everyone in each division pays a different entry fee based on where they are from.
4. Assuming a team can muster the funds, they do have a fair crack at it.
5. Since when are the Americans bothered about having a truly world series? The World Series Baseball is anything but representative of the whole world. Having a few Euro teams in the Div 1 section would not validate the series in any way. I doubt that there are very many Euro teams other than the 5 qualifyiers who are seriously considering playing in the NPPL next year. The only reason that you are doing it Chuck is that the Jags are one of ht eonly teams in the UK (other than Shock, Nexus and the Tigers) who continually stive to improve. I do not think that there are many teams in Europe like you guys. If there were, then more teams than Scalp and Hellwood would have played the NPPL this season.
6. We are not, see above. The only thing that is more expensive is the air fare. I have had a look for next year, and they range from £350 - £750 per ticket. Cars, food, hotels are all cheaper. Even entry fee is cheaper.