Originally posted by HERMITT
Ah Robbo, never one to tread lightly into a debate!
I don't like to disappoint and I also hate fannying around.
The fact is as a middle aged whit emale you won't be stopped that much. Your house won't be raided and you wont have your phone tapped. However, the last time we had draconian stop and search laws was well within the time frame of your life. I dont believe it helped the relations between white and black communities in any way. It didnt lead to any riots or changes in the law at all?!!
This is really confused thinking because it presupposes I have somehow been excluded from the measures I am advocating merely because of my race.
Let me try and make my point a little clearer here, as an individual (race ignored) I don't care how many times you wanna stop and search or me or whatever if it's for the greater good and nor I would add, should any other responsible native of our country, whatever race they are.
Just because at this point the terrorist threat is perceived as Islamic fundamentalism and I probably won't be a suspect doesn't undermine my assertion that if the terrorist threat was the IRA, I would be fine with any so called infringemnts.
The fact is we have defended our rights and freedoms for years. The London bombings, while horrific do not warrant anyone taking these away. While we debate this people in this country are not being maimed, killed or tortured (thanks to the laws we hold so dear. The evil muslim, suicide bombing, child eating *******s that appear in our media dont exist. If you belive this then you are just succumbing to the vast amount of propaganda that is one of the major reasons for the situation we find ourselves in.
Waving the flag on this one ain't gonna fool me I'm afraid Hermit, you cannot automatically equate the negation of rights we have fought for as a direct result of the measures I am suggesting, once again (like Duff), you over dramtise for the sake of your argument.
As for the guys who did the bombing, I don't need no propaganda machine to tell me they are evil, how about I tell ya, they are evil.
The authorities already have more than enough ways to investigate suspects and attempt to stop this happening. The fact is that by its very nature terrorism cannot and will not go away A government minister even accepted that the very basis of a free society is the fact that it will be the victim of those who aim to bring it down.
No problem with the last part of your statement as it's self evident in any state that hasn't all its people locked up behind bars.
I would dispute however that we have enough ways to stop it all because of the very reason we didn't deport or put in jail those people we knew had gone to training camps.
When we see a plane crash, all we see is the carnage and death that it cuases. We forget that flying is the safest form of mass transit in the world. We forget that millions of flights take place each year. Before we get worked up in what we must do to try and stop this happening maybe we should consider the wider impact of giving up our societies core values over a statistically rare event. More people still die from smoking than terrorsm, what would Robbo's solution to that be?
My solution is simple, think about it rationally, prioritise and act on the basis of those two lines of thought.
PC thinking is a great example of core values getting in the way of real life, and trust me that's one fcuked up area but the idealists continue to propogate its so called values.
Anyway, it was nice debating with you guys, I'm outa here on this for no other reason than I have said my piece, make of it what you will, I ain't gonna get into no more, I need to sleep now
Debs...where's that vodka gal?
Peace out
