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Chronicles of War

Furby

Naughty Paintball God
Mar 28, 2002
432
26
28
54
Norman Park, Georgia
www.thefordreport.com
Hi Diane!

Anyways...to my point. I can't believe I'm doing this, but I'm going to defend DeWayne Convirs, the producer of the "D-Day" and "A bridge too far" scenarios here in Oklahoma.

I'll be perfectly honest here...I don't particularly like DeWayne personally, but I do have a somewhat deeper understanding of his motivations for producing D-Day than most people out there. I've interviewed DeWayne twice as part of coverage for his events on FB Radio. One of the first questions I asked him was "Why". His answer surprised me. He produces D-Day (and yes, makes good money doing it) to honor his father, who participated in the D-Day invasion at Normandy. Given that my grandfather served in MASH units during WWII and Korea, I can understand honoring the service those men made, as his grandson.

Each player is assigned a 'unit' as part of his player's pack, and he uses authentic military unit names. Players have the choice of riding in a "Deuce and a half" truck or converted school busses to the field of play. The players themselves are a typical mishmash of kids, hardcore scenario players, and war veterans who've taken up the sport. Yes, there are players walking around in replica SS and wehrmacht uniforms, but I guess I don't share the european oversensitivity(and some americans)to those years. At some point you have to move on, and I feel that 60 years is enough. Probably in 60 years or so, someone will do a scenario game based on the 9/11 bombings or our actions in Tora Bora. It's not so much a trivializing of history, but a way to keep it alive in people's memories. I think that's what DeWayne's intentions are. He's no neo-Nazi, nor is he an insensitive lout just out to make a dollar. DeWayne makes his living in paintball, Surplus sales, and used cars. Needless to say, he's doing okay. He's found a creative and educational way (a serious player will research those uniforms and gear) to honor his father whom he obviously loved dearly, keep the memories of the WWII years alive in people's minds, and make some scratch for himself in the bargain. Given that the number of people attending "The Big War" (local slang for this game) increases from year to year, DeWayne's facilities keep getting better and better, and there is increased industry prescence at these games, indicates to me that DeWayne is doing a good job.

Having said all that, I've never played D-Day. I want to, mainly because the field that DeWayne has constructed looks like it'd be a scream to play on, and with the large number of tanks that attend his events, it's one of the better times to be had out there. Patrick and Diane McKinnon are brilliant scenario game producers, the best out there, hands down. It bothers me that I was only able to play one of their games this past year, but the good news is that once I get moved OUT of oklahoma in a few days, I'll be in a position to attend more of their games. I wanted to reply earlier in this post but I wasn't able to properly explain their motivations for "Chronicles of War". DeWayne's motivations for D-Day are a bit easier to explain, especially if you've ever talked to the guy.
 

Baca Loco

Ex-Fun Police
Thanks, Diane

For taking the time to offer your view. That, of course, is the whole idea. And to the rest of y'all, as well. Keep'um coming.

So what about this niche thing with replica markers? Is paintball drifting into airsoft territory or have I just not been paying attention? And given the political climate regarding guns in general shouldn't responsible paintballers disavow those things except perhaps for real training purposes?
 

Furby

Naughty Paintball God
Mar 28, 2002
432
26
28
54
Norman Park, Georgia
www.thefordreport.com
The replica markers fill a niche of players who want to enhance their experience with an "AK" or "MP5" during their simulated 'battle' experience, which is what paintball is at it's most extreme. Tactical Paintball uses Airsoft shells to make their guns, so maybe there is a bit of synergy there.

As for disavowing them, I don't think that's something that needs to be done. Bobby Gogolin with his replica AK-47 is just as serious a paintball player as I am with my Uprising Autococker. Any concerns about a policeman shooting a paintball player walking around in public with a replica gun are misplaced as well. My dad is a former police officer, and the first time he saw my paintgun, he asked where I'd gotten a Class III (automatic weapons) liscence. Most police officers will mistake a paintball gun for a submachine gun, even if it's pink with red flames on it. A great majority of the public will do the same, simply because a very large portion of the general public is still under the impression that paintball is still something that survival nuts and wannabe rambos do on the weekend to make their nuts swell. I'm starting to see this impression change a bit, and I'm thrilled to death at the prospect. However, walking about in public with a paintgun, replica or not, is a surefire way to get a policeman's gun pointed at your head and some quality time in the back of their car assuming the adrenalin doesn't take over and they cap you just out of fear. The point that I'm trying to make is that it's not a good idea to walk around in the general public with a paintgun of any sort, and I'm not too sure worrying about the media attending a scenario game is much of a concern either. The American news media is woefully inept at covering paintball in general, to the point where it seems like it's a witchhunt, which it is. It's our responsibility as players to guide these people so that the report fairly and accurately. The good news is that more often than not the media will report and comment on tournements, since they're easier to film and understand, at least the basics. With the advent of Shatnerball, and Shatnerball II later this year, the scenario community will play a larger and more important role in presenting the sport to the world. Maybe then worrying about replica guns will have some weight to them, but as of right now I don't think it's a problem.
 

JoseDominguez

New cut and carved spine!
Oct 25, 2002
3,185
0
0
www.myspace.com
Yes, but all it takes is for a few of those photos of kids wearing ss uniforms and carrying markers to hit the mainstream-press and we can forget about being taken seriously. That's it, end of story.
 

JoseDominguez

New cut and carved spine!
Oct 25, 2002
3,185
0
0
www.myspace.com
It could get a whole lot worse, currently trying to ban air guns over here, they haven't rounded on paintball yet, but they will. The military side is all the amo our government will need. A few nice photos here and there in the papers.
 

Buddha 3

Hamfist McPunchalot
Okay, so the guy says he does it to honor his father. I don't buy it. I believe you when you say he said it, but I don't buy into his motives. Anybody who has spoken to veterans of any conflict will understand that these guys for the most part do not appreciate this sort of thing.
Also, if he wants to get things right, tell him to get rid of the SS uniformed players, and lose a lot of the tanks. Armour played a small role on D-day, and there was no SS involvement on the day itself. That sort of means that he really hasn't researched, and is just going for the 'wow' factor.
Sorry, I don't buy his lines.
 

MXS

New Member
Feb 3, 2002
17
0
0
Texas
www.mxspsortz.com
Final comments

Thanks, fellas, for taking the time to respond. Several things here which I'd like to comment on:

Tyger, it was good to finally get in a game with you, at the Shatner event. Imagine my surprise to discover it was you we smoked out in the brush ;)
Anyway, you and I have had lengthy conversations in the past about your past experiences with scenarios and I respect your opinion. Scenarios are not to everyone's taste, just like speedball on a concourse isn't to others. It's a different type of game.

Scenario players are just as intense, competitive and wily - and view their aspect of the sport just as extreme - as every other paintball player. That is one of the aspects that many do not understand. There are teams we consider "professional scenario teams," though the industry in general does not recognize this. MXS sponsors several teams who consistently demonstrate outstanding sportsmanship and fair-play, yet are aggressive on the field, and see to it new players have fun by teaching them the game basics. Education and understanding is key to the comfort level of developing players. Having a hard and fast standard set of rules to play by - that is maintained and absolutely enforced by game staff and referees - is critical for consistency when games are produced at locations across the country.
Unfortunately, as you discovered, not all producers and fields utilize, follow or enforce the rules they tell the players they are using. One of my pet peeves. :rolleyes:

The fact these games are played out over two days over varying terrain and in unpredictable weather conditions - requiring stamina, planning and reliable gear is part of the draw.
I have not attempted to "blackmail" Tyger to attend an MXS game because of the reasons he specified, just as I would not attempt to convince anyone else who believes they would not enjoy themself. I've seen too many people cajoled by family and friends to attend, and in the end, it was not what was described to them. It is all about choice and what your perception of "fun" is. Ultimately, these games are fun to the players who attend them, but it may not be your kind of fun.

Many, many scenario players attend these games for the camraderie and pre- and post-game activities. Entire families play these games. I'm seeing more and more second-generation of scenario families attending these events. The socializing and game-time experiences develops very strong bonds of kinship between players across the country, much like bootcamp bonds individuals into a unit.

As Furby pointed out - and as I discovered my first time as a paintball player - many military veterans play paintball, for different reasons. What sticks out largest, is the opportunity to share their game experiences with others. Having a military themed game is a comfort level they are familiar with, as well. I cut my teeth on military themed scenarios, and enjoyed every one of them, though I have no military background. It was not my intention to deride any one producer - specifically mentioned is Mr. Convirs - but to convey my own personal opinion about a particular themed game which has been done and re-done ad nauseum by not only Mr Convirs, but by several Big Game producers, for many years now. It was more a statement of creativity than anything else. The fact that even our ("tourney ****er") good friend Furby admitted he'd like to play this particular game - and the reasons he gave as to why - are the same reasons so many recball players attend the "D-Day invasion" game, for the reasons I previously listed: the huge playing field, the eye candy, the toys, being part of something larger than life - as SOMEONE ELSE - for a weekend.

I like the avatar Baca Loco uses - what does it convey? A guerilla fighter for paintball. That ain't no paintball marker he's holding!
:D
What does it say to anyone not familiar with him and/or his online personnae? Someone could jump to conclusions. Is it just a personnae? Or does it go deeper? It's a perception! Much like scenario games and players who enjoy them ... and the costumes they wear and the gear they choose to use.

Replica and conversion markers have been around since paintball's inception. Furby constructed a correct response to Baca Loco's questions. Enhancement to the scenario/recball experience is nothing new, but has now become a rabid facet that marker manufacturers are finally realizing as scenarios become the largest growing aspect of the industry. They are playing catch-up to those who were forward-thinking 15 years ago when scenarios busted open. Scenario players have been making their own enhancements and conversions from Day One, and it is these players who are now able to turn their ideas into marketable products. The demand for conversions and replicas has increased as these players demonstrated and played with their own. Video and computer games - as well as movies - that offer cool-looking enhanced "weapons" have raised a generation of paintball players who can now purchase a cool-looking, enhanced paintball marker from a variety of companies.

With this comes a HUGE responsibility that Furby has addressed. It is absolutely necessary for players to take responsiblity for their actions with these replica markers and police our fellow players so the public has nothing to be concerned about from our games and the gear we use. Display of these markers to an unsuspecting public outside of a paintball venue would be like seeing Godzilla running rampant through Manhattan - with the same results.

Publicity for scenario games has been varied in the news media. Speaking as a former employee of a New York Times Regional Newspaper in an editorial position for many years, much of the reporting on these types of games depends on how the reporter looks at the games himself, and how well the promoter of the event relates the concept of the games to the reporter. Like some non-paintball players, a reporter may find the games distasteful or a haven for militia training if not briefed properly. He may come into the game with the desire to project these perceptions for his own agenda - or that of his editor. He may want the promoter to convince him we're not a bunch of nutcases - and the promoter AND the players must do their best to do this. Again, how we monitor and control ourselves and what image we portray is the perception an uninitiated person will go away with.
Should we care? Absolutely, if our games are to be understood for what they are - games. As several responders have stated, it only takes a few misplaced photos, ill-chosen comments or actions of stupidity to derail everything. It is up to ALL of us to be educated and responsible; safe and sane; mature and moral in our actions and responses to queries about what we do for fun and recreation.
 

Tyger

Old School, New Tricks
I have two pictures for you all to look at.

http://www.oklahomadday.com/files/germanuniform.jpg

http://www.oklahomadday.com/files/German.JPG

I can't find the picture I'm looking for, of the young kid in the SS uniform, so these will have to do as examples. Now, imagine the mainstream media getting a hold of these? Yeah, thought you'd be bothered. Oh yeah, and look at http://www.oklahomadday.com/ssrecon.html too, just for historical accuracy. PLUS, they have a military obstacle course that you can compete in, but if you don't you can't go on 'special missions'. Sure, this is "for fun". Yeah.

If the guy does it to honor his father and grandfather, fine. But you can honor their name in other ways. I'm with Buddah here. $60 entry fee, $65 a case of pro ball, and the "Sniper challenge" costs extra. But, then again, I'm biased.

-Tyger