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A must read - PA rule change for the 2005 season

Robeenio

Super Robeenio
Dec 4, 2002
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Staying warm on a sunday!
i think that the control issue is redundant as even though a board may be adding shots as soon as you stop pulling the trigger the gun will stop firing.

so the control is down to the individual.

if you have an overzealous individual who thinks he's arnie and just keeps on killin suckas till they are covered then that guy needs to be punished but just because you have and extra few shots per second does not mean you are out of control!

think this thread is becoming a bit monotonous now with people whining! the law hasn't even been passed yet so lets just see!

peace
 

Baca Loco

Ex-Fun Police
Originally posted by Pump'n'Splat
1--I do. I'm not an experienced baller. my experience is from what I read and how I perceive things when I watch experienced ballers. If i played under this ruling and experienced it differently, I might change my mind. I've made a deduction based on what I know through the experience of others and my resultant feelings are quite strong.

2--It's not that i'm not taking on board collier's (or your) comments, they are validly made, well argued and probably coming from a higher level of experience to me and I like to think that I try to see a subject from all angles. The argument i'll make is that if you say control, not volume, is the issue, how can a cheat board...which is a board designed to fire shots you haven't dialled in yourself, improve control?

3--I just don't think i'm the only person that will have these feelings on the areas i've outlined.
3a--And i'm sure there's people out there with oodles more experience than me that will be able to argue the point from a more hands-on viewpoint.
1--the issue isn't whether you (or I or Russ, etc.) like it. The issue is how best to move forward as a Sport. I realize you don't like this rule change idea and I also note that you're down now to arguing some factor of safety--which I'm about to dismiss. At which point you will only be left with how you feel about it and while valid to you not the best basis for making rules or changes to rules.
2--because, unlike stored shots or bouncing guns, ramped guns stop shooting when the user stops firing. In the instance of various bouncing situations as well as stored shots guns fire even after the user chooses to stop. In the proposed rule change Russ has been discussing it will even be necessary for players to actively pull the trigger at all times if they want the marker to fire. (Unlike the NXL which goes F/A after 3 shots and simply must be held down. NXL boarded guns also stop the instant you let off the trigger.)
So the safety question is one of control over the marker not how many paintballs are capable of coming out of it in a given space of time. In that respect the ramped gun limited to 15 bps is the safer marker compared to the current uncontrolled crop of markers and players predilections towards hair-trigger debounce 1 type set-ups.
3--I'm sure you're not, but again, feelings aren't reasons and while you've made a good effort to come up with reasons mostly they are predicated on a failure to grasp the full situation.
3a--they have been. :)

Now, how 'bout an answer to my question about shouldn't all guns be set-up the same if firing fast is such an important skill?

And another, do you play the P/A? (The answer doesn't invalidate your opinions but I'm curious. The P/A could as easily invite last year's participants to vote on a) change the rule or b) continue to muddle thru best we can; and if players chose b they'd have little room for complaints and the P/A wouldn't have to bother at all.)

EDIT ADDED: Damn! I see I'm too long-winded--once again--for my own good and have been beaten to it, over and over, already. :rolleyes:
 

Russell Smith

The Paintball Association
This Rule is intended to help players, refs and organisers alike and I/we feel it is so important we all go forward together I have already talked to the NPPL(Chuck) and the PSP(Rosie), they do not yet agree with me about the ramping(bps) but I am pleased to say they both agree we should all be in it together.
It would be very silly of us all if we or any of them decided that we will do it our way and sod everyone else.
The only people who would suffer would be the players who may have to own two or three boards for their markers.
Because of that I talked to the big two and asked their opinions and explained why we have to allow ramping, it went so well we are going over the pond to have a meeting in early feb to try and sort this out for the benifit of all paintballers.
My intention is to try and convince them that we must have a least some parity with the rule books, and a rule as radical as this may be just the thing.


Russ
 

manike

INCEPTIONDESIGNS.COM
Jul 9, 2001
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Originally posted by Baca Loco
2--because, unlike stored shots or bouncing guns, ramped guns stop shooting when the user stops firing. In the instance of various bouncing situations as well as stored shots guns fire even after the user chooses to stop. In the proposed rule change Russ has been discussing it will even be necessary for players to actively pull the trigger at all times if they want the marker to fire. (Unlike the NXL which goes F/A after 3 shots and simply must be held down. NXL boarded guns also stop the instant you let off the trigger.)
The NXL code would actually be safer in terms of 'stopping firing when you release the trigger' than Russ's proposed 'keep walking to keep the gun going'.

Because to have the ramping effect Russ is talking about the gun actual HAS to keep firing after the trigger is released. With the NXL code it actually stops immediately.

How long the 'PA ramping code' would fire after you release the trigger and thus how 'fast' you would have to walk the trigger is a question to answer.

/me has guns with all this stuff on.

NXL code is 'safer' :rolleyes: in my opinion. But it is very defnitely FA. Not like the PA proposal isn't FA :rolleyes:
 

Liz

New Member
Jan 17, 2002
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Originally posted by Bolter
So will a "yes we are" or a "no we are not" be announced after said Feb meeting Russ?
It's still got to get through the Home Office as well, it's not just a decision by the various tournament organisers.

BTW, all those arguing about this rule letting inexperienced (and therefore uncontrolled or iresponsible) players shoot as fast as experienced (and therefore responsible) players, that isn't really valid. There are some people who have the knack of shooting fast from day one, and others (like me) who will never be able to shoot fast however much they practice (given up after about 15 years!). And some of the most irresponsible players around are those with a couple of years play under their belts - experience does NOT equate with responsibility!
 

Russell Smith

The Paintball Association
Originally posted by manike
The NXL code would actually be safer in terms of 'stopping firing when you release the trigger' than Russ's proposed 'keep walking to keep the gun going'.
. But it is very defnitely FA. Not like the PA proposal isn't FA :rolleyes:

We have talked about the NXL chip and we have been told that a court of law only has the power to say we can use it.
The Home Office is being very good with us at the moment and if they agree with what we want to do they will suggest the ramp level and we will ask others to follow it.
So there is no chance of full auto but the HO will tell the police forces in England and Wales what they have said we can use, and that will stop them looking.
Liz is right nobody can just say we are doing this, we must have the ok from the Home Office first.
But we are trying.


Russ