NXL/PSP Rumor

[Intheno]

Buddha, yes darling, I was being sarcastic.

Loco, what was I supposed to be beating? How rude! I see now why you are so successful in driving people away from the boards.

I foresee a time when you are the only guy on P8ntballer, baiting with new conspiracy posts, then hovering vulture-like for some poor cretin to post something so you can belittle thier opinions and molest them with your own jaded take on paintball industry. Think of the fun you could have!!


Look at the figures issued about the orlando event. Study them a little. Then cast your mind back to the event. Thats all you have to do. Then wonder whether if the attendance figures are shamelessly cooked, are the veiwing figures issued also inaccurate? If only these figures had come from an independant media firm, like the NPPL's stats, then we could have a little more faith in them...
Another thing, why have you not questioned these figures yourself Comrade. Are you not an equal opportunity conspiracy theorist? Did you swallow those figures Loco, or is your own bias beginning to shine through. I feel certain that if the NPPL had issued figures that defy peoples memory of an event a few short months ago, that you would have something to say about that. Why so tight lipped on the PSP's orlando stats?

 

[Buddha 3]

Originally posted by Intheno
Buddha, yes darling, I was being sarcastic.

Thanks sweety.

As for the rest of your post, it wasn't aimed at me, but if you look around, I think you'll find that Paul has a tendency to pretty much throw mud at any established series, not just the NPPL.

Fukk it, he can answer his own stuff.

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by Intheno
Look at the figures issued about the orlando event. Study them a little. Then cast your mind back to the event. Thats all you have to do. Then wonder whether if the attendance figures are shamelessly cooked, are the veiwing figures issued also inaccurate? If only these figures had come from an independant media firm, like the NPPL's stats, then we could have a little more faith in them...

Another thing, why have you not questioned these figures yourself Comrade. Are you not an equal opportunity conspiracy theorist? Did you swallow those figures Loco, or is your own bias beginning to shine through. I feel certain that if the NPPL had issued figures that defy peoples memory of an event a few short months ago, that you would have something to say about that. Why so tight lipped on the PSP's orlando stats?

An independent media firm! Wow! Mighty high falutin' sounding.
Yessiree, shame on those bumpkins over at the PSP for trying to do what the NPPL already does.

For all I know the PSP's Orlando Open efforts at self-promotion reflected the number of peeps who visited all Disney properties during the period of the tournament. As such they would have been exposed in one way or another to info about the event being present and so PSP put that happy face on their PR.
Last week after the HB04 show on FSN the NPPL put out a PR piece proclaiming 88 million homes reached. Huzzah! All that really meant was that FSN is reputed to have cable connection to that many homes but it wasn't presented that way.
Neither one is substantially different than me claiming I can reach 3 billion people anytime--'cus I have a telephone. True but not really meaningful. Same thing with bulk of PB PR.
I don't slam either side for playing the PR game and the PSP has a shedload of work to do just to try and catch up. It's worth the occasional joke but that's about it.

 

[Intheno]

I know, I'm just giving him something to aim at. He gets bored I think, and now I have given him the opportunity to write a disproportionately long answer with lots of long flowery words, carefully broken down into bullet points. Believe me, he's a happy little communist right now...

EDIT ADDED: Whoops! Wrong--again! TFP

LOL - yes, when did you get so unpredictable?

 

[Intheno]

Baca, you are totally right about the viewing figures (the 88 million homes bit). This is actually the bullxxxx that the TV companies throw at the leagues to encourage them to invest, so as such the leagues are just regurgitating the same barely truthful and highly confusing stats.

The Event stats are different in my opinion. They were simply cooked, something I am not aware of the NPPL doing. It seems that a conscious decision has been made by the PSP to up-spec the propaganda, which is fine, but by over-cooking the figures I think they have lost mucho credibility and will have trouble making me believe any numbers they issue in the future. You don't agree?

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by Intheno
Baca, you are totally right about the viewing figures (the 88 million homes bit).

This is actually the bullxxxx that the TV companies throw at the leagues to encourage them to invest, so as such the leagues are just regurgitating the same barely truthful and highly confusing stats.

The Event stats are different in my opinion. They were simply cooked, something I am not aware of the NPPL doing. It seems that a conscious decision has been made by the PSP to up-spec the propaganda, which is fine, but by over-cooking the figures I think they have lost mucho credibility and will have trouble making me believe any numbers they issue in the future. You don't agree?

Well, d'oh!

And that the NPPL has, with bold graphic alacrity, shoveled up to the PB public.

I don't see any substantive difference at all, for a few reasons. One, you are picking and choosing your citations (while suggesting it's the bad TV peeps responsibility for the NPPL numbers or was that the independent media group?) Two, if we really wanted to dissect this we'd have to examine the record of both organizations and the NPPL/PP have a much vaster public record. If we were to go thru the pronouncements following some the NPPL events, particularly from Year One we would rediscover some serious whoppers.
Regardless, in both cases competing organizations are trying to make themselves look good. I don't view any of it as much different than the standard crowd shot that chooses an angle and focus to make a modest crowd in tiny stands appear to be a wild throng. It's all disingenuous.
And anyone who isn't skeptical of both sides pronouncements is a fool. The real problem isn't one of credibility on issues like attendance, it's whether that potential lack of credibility does (or should) carry over to other issues that actually impact the teams and players.

PS--That's why the NXL has a leg up on everyone. They don't tell anybody anything.

 

[Intheno]

I belive the NPPL can stand behind their 'wild' claims. In my experience they have been careful not to get egg on thier faces. The NPPLs markerting is aggressive, yet accurate, if you took the time to analyse it.
My opinion is that in this case the PSP has thought, as you did, that all they had to do was run out some numbers like the NPPL with plenty of Zero's and they would be believed.
Think about it Cowboy, would someone, who is constantly chastised for being totally NPPL biased, draw attention to figures like this knowing it would encourage attention to the NPPLs comparative propaganda if they knew the NPPL's own numbers were cooked. It would be a little silly don't you think?

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by Intheno
I belive the NPPL can stand behind their 'wild' claims. In my experience they have been careful not to get egg on thier faces. The NPPLs markerting is aggressive, yet accurate, if you took the time to analyse it.
My opinion is that in this case the PSP has thought, as you did, that all they had to do was run out some numbers like the NPPL with plenty of Zero's and they would be believed.
Think about it Cowboy, would someone, who is constantly chastised for being totally NPPL biased, draw attention to figures like this knowing it would encourage attention to the NPPLs comparative propaganda if they knew the NPPL's own numbers were cooked. It would be a little silly don't you think?

You're all over the board as usual. First it was the NPPL PR is reliable 'cus it all comes from an independent media firm. Then it was those nasty TV peeps pushing grandiose numbers, not the NPPL's fault. Now it's "I believe the NPPL can stand behind their 'wild' claims"... Based on what? Intuition.
All the while it's the PSP making stuff up outta whole cloth at last year's Orlando Open. Based on what? Your impression of the event? Feel free to bust on the PSP for one event, one time, last year.
If you really wanna go down this road where did the HB numbers come from? For either year. An actual head count of distinct individuals over the period of the event or the usual estimation based on prior estimates during other local HB events, the normal weekend traffic around the pier, and/or the inclusion of the participants, vendors, etc? Obviously the numbers given aren't accurate in a numerical sense nor do they separate out unique visitors or even those who paid more than scant attention to the tournament. There simply is no real way to validate any of those claims.
What actually mattered was that the venue placed PB in front of people and did so in a ground-breaking environment. That part is undeniable. All the rest is just blather and as I stated before--anyone who doesn't read ALL the PR with a healthy skepticism is a fool.
As to whether or not "aggressive marketing" can have a deleterious effect over time in producing cynicism I'll leave to you to decide.

 

[Intheno]

The HB numbers came from the city of HB, both years, and were presented to the industry as such. HB have camera's on the beach at all times, these are monitored for foot traffic and actually used by the city to see which events create the most traffic, and by relation, the most $ brought in to local businesses.
Claims were not made as to what these people did while they were there, the numbers were used to recognise the ammount of people 'exposed to Paintball', so a defense of such hyperthetical claims is not needed.
The NPPL have a meeting with city officials after the event and the city provides the data, not the NPPL itself. If this does not validate any claims then I suggest you stand by the side of the event and do your own calculations, at least you could then speak with a little more authority, and would be able to present a more informed argument, such as it is.
Of course you already know that the HB figures can't be broken down, which is why you pre-empted my post by stating that, but it does not invalidate anything. The City of HB is independant. They provided the figures, therefore it is not possible for the NPPL to have misrepresented this info.

I answered one of yours (without the use of intuition). Now tell me where the PSP count came from? Or is that not as interesting?

actually, don't bother. Just go on the way you are. Ignorance (or healthy skepticism as you call it) is bliss.

 

[Baca Loco]

Originally posted by Intheno
I answered one of yours (without the use of intuition). Now tell me where the PSP count came from? Or is that not as interesting?

actually, don't bother. Just go on the way you are. Ignorance (or healthy skepticism as you call it) is bliss.

I already offered a possible answer. Apparently you didn't bother to read it. I have no idea where their number came from and as I stated earlier when you a) first implied my lack of interest was bias, and b) continued to make this an issue, I didn't find it a worthwhile topic because I frankly don't expect any of the various PB entities to do other than toot their own horns as loudly as possible and massage the "truth" as convenient.

My last two posts on this topic (not including this one) were in response to questions you posed. If you don't like the answers, stop asking the questions.