Idea for I.D. card/player registration system
- Thread starter goose
- Start date
R
raehl
Guest
A few suggestions.
1) You can very easily keep track of exactly what events a player plays on. If you have someone who will spend the time to reliably put in how each team finishes at each event, it's trivial for the system to "rank" players using whatever criteria you want - including only counting points from previous seasons (i.e. you never move up mid season, because only your point total as of Jan 1 counts for the next year.)
2) The system does not do well with information it doesn't have - which means it isn't going to do you any good unless many leagues are using it. So the first part is making it as EASY and as INEXPENSIVE as possible for leagues to use it. Even then, you still need to have people checking photo ID on the field (whether it's palyer ID, which oyu need photo ID to get, or just government photo ID as it currently is in PSP), a SIGNIFICANT portion of the time - a player should have a reasonable expectation of getting checked at least once at a tournament. How are you going to make sure legues are doing this? Is the EPA going to volunteer staff to do it?
Honestly, I'd offer the ID system to other leagues for the sake of giving them the ability to know which of their players are playing Millenium, but I wouldn't try and count local event experience in Millenium rankings.
Why?
Because all you have to do to artificially deflate your ranking is not play non-Millenium events, or at least not non-millenium events who use the ID system. And if you're giving the players a reason to avoid the ID system, then you're giving the promoters a reason to avoid the ID system.
You don't want to push people up for paying. You want to push them up for winning (at the level you're considering, winning a local event shouldn't mean jack **** in regards to what your millenium ranking is), and make sure they stay up once they get there.
I mean, if I go out and play my local 5-man event this weekend, should that effect my liklihood of being pushed to Novice at Cup? Of course not - it's two totally different animals.
- Chris
1) You can very easily keep track of exactly what events a player plays on. If you have someone who will spend the time to reliably put in how each team finishes at each event, it's trivial for the system to "rank" players using whatever criteria you want - including only counting points from previous seasons (i.e. you never move up mid season, because only your point total as of Jan 1 counts for the next year.)
2) The system does not do well with information it doesn't have - which means it isn't going to do you any good unless many leagues are using it. So the first part is making it as EASY and as INEXPENSIVE as possible for leagues to use it. Even then, you still need to have people checking photo ID on the field (whether it's palyer ID, which oyu need photo ID to get, or just government photo ID as it currently is in PSP), a SIGNIFICANT portion of the time - a player should have a reasonable expectation of getting checked at least once at a tournament. How are you going to make sure legues are doing this? Is the EPA going to volunteer staff to do it?
Honestly, I'd offer the ID system to other leagues for the sake of giving them the ability to know which of their players are playing Millenium, but I wouldn't try and count local event experience in Millenium rankings.
Why?
Because all you have to do to artificially deflate your ranking is not play non-Millenium events, or at least not non-millenium events who use the ID system. And if you're giving the players a reason to avoid the ID system, then you're giving the promoters a reason to avoid the ID system.
You don't want to push people up for paying. You want to push them up for winning (at the level you're considering, winning a local event shouldn't mean jack **** in regards to what your millenium ranking is), and make sure they stay up once they get there.
I mean, if I go out and play my local 5-man event this weekend, should that effect my liklihood of being pushed to Novice at Cup? Of course not - it's two totally different animals.
- Chris
In judo british tournaments have a ranking system ....
Only the top ranked events effect your national ranking and are the only ones considered for entrance into the national squad
under that you have events that allow you to score points towards your next grade
under then you have local and area events which only gain you a trophy or a medal but don't count for much else except pesonal satisfaction.
so in theory you could grade paintball events depending on size, quality of teams entering, etc (Millenium series woud be a 5 star event where Joe Bloggs one off site tournie might only be 1 star)
so when a player plays an event you can assign experience points but also class them to the type of event they were acquired.
so then when calculating what level a player should be at a millenium event you would only assess top level tournament experience and some sort of weighting system for lesser tournies.
just a thought
Only the top ranked events effect your national ranking and are the only ones considered for entrance into the national squad
under that you have events that allow you to score points towards your next grade
under then you have local and area events which only gain you a trophy or a medal but don't count for much else except pesonal satisfaction.
so in theory you could grade paintball events depending on size, quality of teams entering, etc (Millenium series woud be a 5 star event where Joe Bloggs one off site tournie might only be 1 star)
so when a player plays an event you can assign experience points but also class them to the type of event they were acquired.
so then when calculating what level a player should be at a millenium event you would only assess top level tournament experience and some sort of weighting system for lesser tournies.
just a thought
Skiggles...
My idea exactly...
Teams would only get points when competing in "worthy" tournaments/series that are sanctioned/associated with the EPA.
Not that all tournaments aren't worthy - hell any time we can get to play then so be it - but only the tournaments where we are sure - or as sure as we can be - that the competition is up to the standards set out.
The series I have in mind would be along the lines of the Nordic series, the M25, the French series, German series etc..
Joe Blow's 10 team pub series - unfortunately would be excluded.
goose
My idea exactly...
Teams would only get points when competing in "worthy" tournaments/series that are sanctioned/associated with the EPA.
Not that all tournaments aren't worthy - hell any time we can get to play then so be it - but only the tournaments where we are sure - or as sure as we can be - that the competition is up to the standards set out.
The series I have in mind would be along the lines of the Nordic series, the M25, the French series, German series etc..
Joe Blow's 10 team pub series - unfortunately would be excluded.
goose
Goose, suppose that joe blows pub series was made up of all or mostly all ranked teams that played other events too.
Even though small would that not qualify? Granted depending on how much work each tourney series is to add to the ranking system it may not be worth it for whoever runs the system.
I just thought that perhaps if teams are going to choose between tourneys, one ranking and one not, then lots of smaller local tourneys will dry up due to lack of interest. Which then has a knock on effect to the number of new tourney teams starting and the whole scene declines again.
If you know you can go down the road and play a tourney every month on top of travelling to a major one then you will play it. Add rankings to it and the team may decide to play one big tourney a month and travel further afield to play in other extra ranking events, but only a few times a year.
Just my 2p's worth.
laterz
Ian
Even though small would that not qualify? Granted depending on how much work each tourney series is to add to the ranking system it may not be worth it for whoever runs the system.
I just thought that perhaps if teams are going to choose between tourneys, one ranking and one not, then lots of smaller local tourneys will dry up due to lack of interest. Which then has a knock on effect to the number of new tourney teams starting and the whole scene declines again.
If you know you can go down the road and play a tourney every month on top of travelling to a major one then you will play it. Add rankings to it and the team may decide to play one big tourney a month and travel further afield to play in other extra ranking events, but only a few times a year.
Just my 2p's worth.
laterz
Ian
IanC - the whole idea would be to get any "worthy" series/tournament to become affiliated with us.
If a whole bunch of teams then wish to go play amongst themselves, at an un-affiliated tournament then go ahead - but hopefully there will be enough benefits for them not to.
EVERYONE....
What I am discussing here is something that will take TIME and ENERGY to implement. It's not something that will happen over night. Hell if it ready by the end of next season - for Millennium use - I will be happy. All the other series will be able to latch on when they wish.
This is just one of the things in the back of my mind, other EPA benefits are also bubling around in there - we just have to proceed slowly. I DO NOT WANT TO FCUK THINGS UP RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING.
It has been a MAJOR accomplishment to get a partial commitment from the MS just to attend their meeting. Also while the idea of the EPA is something that I feel is worth doing - and am willing to put in the work - please keep in mind that there are ONLY 329 REGISTERED PLAYERS. So if we only take the minimum numbers from Campaign (1120 players) we are still WAY SHORT. This also doesn't include all the "regional teams" who either never go to Millennium events (just play Nordic, M25 etc.) or only play the Millennium closest to them.
I implore EVERY PLAYER to look at what the EPA has to accomplish as a marathon NOT a sprint. Good things take time - and as stated before we want to get it right. We need to have a solid foundation before we can start building.
goose
If a whole bunch of teams then wish to go play amongst themselves, at an un-affiliated tournament then go ahead - but hopefully there will be enough benefits for them not to.
EVERYONE....
What I am discussing here is something that will take TIME and ENERGY to implement. It's not something that will happen over night. Hell if it ready by the end of next season - for Millennium use - I will be happy. All the other series will be able to latch on when they wish.
This is just one of the things in the back of my mind, other EPA benefits are also bubling around in there - we just have to proceed slowly. I DO NOT WANT TO FCUK THINGS UP RIGHT FROM THE BEGINNING.
It has been a MAJOR accomplishment to get a partial commitment from the MS just to attend their meeting. Also while the idea of the EPA is something that I feel is worth doing - and am willing to put in the work - please keep in mind that there are ONLY 329 REGISTERED PLAYERS. So if we only take the minimum numbers from Campaign (1120 players) we are still WAY SHORT. This also doesn't include all the "regional teams" who either never go to Millennium events (just play Nordic, M25 etc.) or only play the Millennium closest to them.
I implore EVERY PLAYER to look at what the EPA has to accomplish as a marathon NOT a sprint. Good things take time - and as stated before we want to get it right. We need to have a solid foundation before we can start building.
goose
I don't know how well this would apply to paintball but when people are organising lesser judo tournaments they tactically place them a couple weeks before a major tournament so the better players use them as warm up/ practice events to get on top of their game before the big event...
you might find paintball tournies would work well like this too.
you might find paintball tournies would work well like this too.
R
raehl
Guest
Goose...
I feel that it is my duty to inform you, as a person with some experience in such matters, that you're an idiot. Quit now and get out while you can.
In about three years, after putting excessive amounts of your time and money into making this thing work and being unable to voluntarily make yourself stop, you'll probably have a better idea what I mean.
I just don't want you to ever say I didn't warn you. Welcome to the suckers club.
- Chris
I feel that it is my duty to inform you, as a person with some experience in such matters, that you're an idiot. Quit now and get out while you can.
In about three years, after putting excessive amounts of your time and money into making this thing work and being unable to voluntarily make yourself stop, you'll probably have a better idea what I mean.
I just don't want you to ever say I didn't warn you. Welcome to the suckers club.
- Chris