Getting the local press interested

[Hatts]

Originally posted by Buddha 3
Hatts,

You're taking Stongle's post way too personal. It's not an attack on you, it ain't an attack at all.
What he is saying is that at this point in time all we see is words and nothing more. If all works out fine, great! If it doesn't, well you tried. As we say in Holland, you are selling the bear's fur before you have actually shot the damn thing.

I love that .. I didn't know they had bears in Holland...

I take offense because anyone who knows either myself or Gillie also knows that if we say we're doing sometyhing we do it. We don't deal in half truths or attempts to mislead people. We said we'd make a video of the 2K2 Storming the castle and we did...10K worth of production crew...we said we'd run the PA Cup to the highest standards and we did...with only 11 teams when anyone else would have cancelled...We said we'd launch a UK magazine and we did...and a year later it's still here...

If there's a post goes up from the PA saying the PA league is going to be on Sky Sports...that's because it is.

Since we launched the PA, it's magazine, the league, cup and now Fantasy Paintball we've been under personal attack from a significant number of sides, for some bizarre reason from people who I can only guess feel threatened by what we're doing, and quite frankly I'm getting tired of it. I object very strongly to Stongles inference that we're trying to make some kind of freak show and the players are nothing more than performing "monkeys".

Why should these guys be viewed as any less professional than anyone else? Just because they don't play in the States every weekend?

In my opinion it belittles the efforts of the PA and all those involved with it.

So yes I do take it personally....

 

[Hatts]

Originally posted by Buddha 3
A serious sportsmen, i.e. a pro, mostly plays to cater to his ego. Trust me, I've been around a few (in more sports than just paintball)
If you want to compete at the top levels in any game, you have to lose the "****s and giggles" attitude, and all you want to do is assert your dominance. In other words, be the alpha male/female. No more, no less.

Losing the "****s & giggles" is exactly what the PA is about...I can not for the life of me think why anyone would assume otherwise?

 

[Buddha 3]

Okay, your first post:
"I love that .. I didn't know they had bears in Holland...

I take offense because anyone who knows either myself or Gillie also knows that if we say we're doing sometyhing we do it. We don't deal in half truths or attempts to mislead people. We said we'd make a video of the 2K2 Storming the castle and we did...10K worth of production crew...we said we'd run the PA Cup to the highest standards and we did...with only 11 teams when anyone else would have cancelled...We said we'd launch a UK magazine and we did...and a year later it's still here...

If there's a post goes up from the PA saying the PA league is going to be on Sky Sports...that's because it is.

Since we launched the PA, it's magazine, the league, cup and now Fantasy Paintball we've been under personal attack from a significant number of sides, for some bizarre reason from people who I can only guess feel threatened by what we're doing, and quite frankly I'm getting tired of it. I object very strongly to Stongles inference that we're trying to make some kind of freak show and the players are nothing more than performing "monkeys".

Why should these guys be viewed as any less professional than anyone else? Just because they don't play in the States every weekend?

In my opinion it belittles the efforts of the PA and all those involved with it.

So yes I do take it personally...."

So now you know why there are no bears in Holland anymore.
What I got out of Stongle's post is not that he's saying you're not going to do it, or that you are misleading anyone. What I got out of it is he's saying that some people think that this will be the saviour of paintball. And I'm sure you agree, that remains to be seen, since nobody can tell the future. A number of people (not saying any names) seem to slapping eachother on the back for being big movie stars already, and that's a bit premature. The way I see it, Stongle's not saying you are talking ****, he's just being critical. Dunno why I am defending his posts by the way, he's man enough to do it himself.

Your second post:
"Losing the "****s & giggles" is exactly what the PA is about...I can not for the life of me think why anyone would assume otherwise?"
Some people might see the whole thing as the ****s and giggles factor. You may not mean it to be such, but some people will undoubtably play the event because of the novelty value of the TV being there, not because of the topnotch competition (which may be there, but that won't be the reason these people are attending).

I hope you see what I'm getting at.

 

[Hatts]

ahh...plain english (and from a Dutchman no less ) ...yes I do see what you're getting at...and thank you.

Interesting choice of phrase..."the saviour of paintball"..you think we need one?

Some people might see the whole thing as the ****s and giggles factor. You may not mean it to be such, but some people will undoubtably play the event because of the novelty value of the TV being there, not because of the topnotch competition

You're no doubt right that some people will be tempted by the idea of bright lights and the chance of fame...which I actually do keep telling people is not going to happen and is not why we announced the Sky Sports thing in the first place for the "giggle" factor.

I can say that anyone who is thinking along those lines is in for a shock and probably won't last long, unless they take in the rest of what all the other teams are doing and adapt...none of the managers who've organised teams think they're in for an easy ride to TV stardom...there's a lot of committment, sweat, blood and tears going into this...

The official announcment was supposed to come at the PA managers conference on Feb 01st so in actual fact no one outside of the PA would have even got wind of it until after the doors were closed. That was my mistake and no one elses for releasing the information early...


Just as an after thought...
I just have this nagging feeling that Stongl didn't post anything similar regarding the announcement that the Fox network were interested in paintball or indeed any posts of a similar nature regarding the Super 7's, X-ball, NXL ...or any of the other myriad of changes that have happened in paintball in the last 2 years.. Each of these also have their supporters singing their respective praises so it seems somewhat unfair to chose the criteria of the PA to "discuss" (note I don't say "attack") with a what I consider to be a very negative approach.

 

[Buddha 3]

Originally posted by Hatts
Interesting choice of phrase..."the saviour of paintball"..you think we need one?

Well, we do if we want paintball to go bigtime. We need a format that is easily televisable, but that's a different thread altogether.
Personally, I just like playing ball, and if truth be known, I'd rather not see most of the people I meet at tournaments on TV.

 

[Hatts]

watch "storming the Castle" 2K2 final.... obviously I'm biased, but I think it comes across as easily televisable if shot this way...

 

[Collier]

Originally posted by Hatts
watch "storming the Castle" 2K2 final.... obviously I'm biased, but I think it comes across as easily televisable if shot this way...

Where can I get a copy?

Paul

 

[stongle]

Right just back from lunch.....

I don't think you fully read my posts at all did you?. I have acknowledged on numerous occasions, that you have had the boll*x to put your money where your mouth is, and your belief in how to develop and take paintball forward. I've already given you credit for that, and promoted the fact you have the courage of your convictions. Why you take any other viewpoints other than your own as criticism I don't know, and it sounds a bit narrow minded.

I floated the singular argument that being geographically linked was not the only route to success (and challenged them to think outside of the box), as is hurled around by certain posters. Yours maybe the majority viewpoint of the UK posters, or the people you surround yourself with and in the end come out to be correct. Be that as it may other views exist and this is a forum for debate, perhaps other posters have felt intimidated into questioning the ethos, thrust or policy with fear of getting flambéed by your vocal support.

I've already stated that I sincerely hope it does work out for you, but I will reserve my right to question the arguments made especially if these are made in a public forum. Sometimes it might be Devils advocate, sometime my own conviction, however this is a discussion board, not advertising or preaching to the converted space. If you wish to promote your tournament through a discussion board, you should expect some feedback. Your supporters are plenty able of making clearly constructed arguments as to why they believe in the ethos of the series. None of the Mods, P8 or PGI in general is pushing a totalitarian agenda nor do we gag posters unless self promotion / advertisement is bordering on excess (unlike many other sites or boards etc). The Mods here are to facilitate debate, but also to ensure all sides are heard from all locations. We've been repeatedly through the UK versus rest of the world argument, but don't you think it would be beneficial to the UK balling community to think outside the box or Internationally for a change?

I'm sorry I don't park my car in the same garage as you, but does the "whole" paintballing community think as you and your support.

Oh and by the way, I don't play or represent Severe Monkey Love anymore, so my views definitely are my own, and definitely NOT "attributable" to those guys or the team.......ok.

 

[Hatts]

I think Planet might have an odd copy floating around or possibly Phoenix...there's a few floating about that I'm sure someone could let you borrow...

Gillie did say she'd get a small batch done if there was enough interest...

 

[Hatts]

Oh and by the way, I don't play or represent Severe Monkey Love anymore, so my views definitely are my own, and definitely NOT "attributable" to those guys or the team.......ok.

Just so we're clear where we stand on this particular point...I never mentioned your previous team, in fact I couldn't even remember who you were playing for when I made reference to previous posts...nor did I ever accredit any of your opionions to your team mates...only you

To be honest Stongl you've just made my day. 18 months ago we started out as the underdog in all this with virtually no support and had to fight tooth and nail for every inch of ground we've gained and now you seem to be implying that we have some kind of clan following and can "intimidate" people into questioning our ethos. That is absolutely amazing. I hadn't realised we'd climbed so far up the hill or were such a force to be reckoned with

I'm willing to listen to and discuss anyones POV...what I object to and take as critiscism is people refelecting on what we're trying to do in a negative light without the good grace to be equally objective about everything else that's going on. Can I take it that you don't have similar feelings about what X-ball is trying to achieve or that the Fox network is just making performing monkeys out of players?

For some reason, and I refer back to an earlier thread, you really seem to have a thing about what we're doing and will go to great lengths (and really long posts) in order to put your point across.

I thank you for acknowledging that we've had the boll*x to put our money where our mouth is so to speak...I do feel that given your current role as a moderator adds unfair weight to your opinion which lets face it, does rather portray the PA and it's efforts in a negative way when referring the those involved as "performing monkeys" and comes across to me that you've perhaps not fully grasped what we're about.

There is no argument of UK v's the rest of the world. My goal is to raise the standard of UK paintball so that we can take it to the rest of the world.

Our whole philosophy right from the beginning is to put what we're offering on display and say "Here it is...join if you wan't to or don't if you don't"...no one is being coerced into this...and following your line that this is a discussion board and I should expect "feedback" I also take the stand that I can also return the compliment and defend myself and my beliefs....especially when I consider them to be under attack...

I fully agree that the "geographical" aspect is one small part of the whole thing, but it's also a key one...

Perhaps you'd like to come along the Managers Conference on Sunday and see what it's all about. You have an open invitation as my personal guest...