BE sues HALO
- Thread starter Beaker
- Start date
Rather than try to sue the shiznit outta some insightful guys that have made the effort to give improvements to the sport, wouldn't it be a REALLY good idea for BE to kick back, re-think where they could improve the products for US and save all that money that'd be needed for court cases and spend it on r & d??
My Revo is ok but the way marker tech is going now, feed speed needs to be improved. Well done Halo dudes, that's all I can say.
My Revo is ok but the way marker tech is going now, feed speed needs to be improved. Well done Halo dudes, that's all I can say.
Mr Big - full release is here
Buddha - remember the Rico agitates every time a ball is fired. So you can't ever get that thing like with Rev's where you overfill the hopper - shoot a few then the motor doesn't sense a gap so you end up with none down the feed neck.
Al etc - I can't say i agree with how BE have done it (i.e. let Odyssey go so far down the road before hitting them) but it is after all their right to protect business. $$$$ count unfortunately.
And while i commend Odessey for what they have done their design is soooo close to the BE patents it wasn't exactly unexpected. Rico have had no problems AFAIK with BE because they developed something which was unique (and IMHO better). They steered clear of anything which was too close to BE and started from the ground up.
Buddha - remember the Rico agitates every time a ball is fired. So you can't ever get that thing like with Rev's where you overfill the hopper - shoot a few then the motor doesn't sense a gap so you end up with none down the feed neck.
Al etc - I can't say i agree with how BE have done it (i.e. let Odyssey go so far down the road before hitting them) but it is after all their right to protect business. $$$$ count unfortunately.
And while i commend Odessey for what they have done their design is soooo close to the BE patents it wasn't exactly unexpected. Rico have had no problems AFAIK with BE because they developed something which was unique (and IMHO better). They steered clear of anything which was too close to BE and started from the ground up.
Mmmmmmm
interesting this one.
Do BE have the sole right to the entire concept of motorised loaders?? If so then I suppose they have the right to sue some ass BUT, the guy who invented the first car....did he sue the person who made a different, better car than his??? If you see what I'm getting at.
Adidas don't sue Nike for having a more comfortable running shoe do they.
I know it may not make sense but can one company monopolise the idea of something that could spawn sooooo many different variations??
interesting this one.
Do BE have the sole right to the entire concept of motorised loaders?? If so then I suppose they have the right to sue some ass BUT, the guy who invented the first car....did he sue the person who made a different, better car than his??? If you see what I'm getting at.
Adidas don't sue Nike for having a more comfortable running shoe do they.
I know it may not make sense but can one company monopolise the idea of something that could spawn sooooo many different variations??
Gee, Beaker, thanks for explaining guys.
I never had a close look at a Rico. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't want one within 5 feet of my marker, because I fear the uglyness might be contageous!
They may work fine, but man are they OOGLY!
I never had a close look at a Rico. As a matter of fact, I wouldn't want one within 5 feet of my marker, because I fear the uglyness might be contageous!
They may work fine, but man are they OOGLY!
Buddha - I feel they are an aquired taste - they go real well with angular milling such as Eclipse though plus the smoke ones look sooo much nicer Say hi at Mayhem and I'll convert ya'
Al - AFAIK there are 2 main things that BE has over Odyssey.
First is the use of an "eye". HALO uses an eye to sense the presence of the ball - the BE (i.e. Viewloader) patent is for an eye that senses the absence of a ball. I would have thought that by definition an eye that senses the precence of the ball MUST sense the absence so I think Odyssey might be in hot water anyway.
The second is the principle of how the balls are sorted for delivery to the gun. The "Egg-olution" patent is for a rotating disc/tray at the bottom of the loader which sorts the balls before it pushes/releases them down the feeb tube. Again the HALO does almost exactly that. I have heard that it's this second bit that BE are fighting this battle on but they might pull the "eye" arguement out later.
Like I said the Zap uses a vibration sensor and the Rico a bend sensor - neither of which come close to the BE patents so have been "untouchable". My point is NOT that I agree with BE - in fact I personally would never buy a BE product again.
But whatever I/you think of BE - the Odyssey has used specific features and ideas that have been under patent for a LONG time and so I don't see how they can be pitied
plus the smoke ones look sooo much nicer Say hi at Mayhem and I'll convert ya' Al - AFAIK there are 2 main things that BE has over Odyssey.
First is the use of an "eye". HALO uses an eye to sense the presence of the ball - the BE (i.e. Viewloader) patent is for an eye that senses the absence of a ball. I would have thought that by definition an eye that senses the precence of the ball MUST sense the absence so I think Odyssey might be in hot water anyway.
The second is the principle of how the balls are sorted for delivery to the gun. The "Egg-olution" patent is for a rotating disc/tray at the bottom of the loader which sorts the balls before it pushes/releases them down the feeb tube. Again the HALO does almost exactly that. I have heard that it's this second bit that BE are fighting this battle on but they might pull the "eye" arguement out later.
Like I said the Zap uses a vibration sensor and the Rico a bend sensor - neither of which come close to the BE patents so have been "untouchable". My point is NOT that I agree with BE - in fact I personally would never buy a BE product again.
But whatever I/you think of BE - the Odyssey has used specific features and ideas that have been under patent for a LONG time and so I don't see how they can be pitied
Well Al this 1 is hard so ill try 2 keep it simple.
Patents r a PAIN,patents r limited2 certain things& THERE IS A REAL FINE LINE ON ALL THIS SO UVE GOT 2 GIVE A LOT OF LEE-WAY ON WOT I SAY !!! they only really started in the 40s-50s i think-shoes etc r not under this cos people have been wearing shoes,clothes 4 so long that it cant b done.
Trade marks & patents work in the same way.
If u make a product or logo u see the goverment type thingy commitee,where they have records of these things & they see if ur item is the same/relates 2 wot another company have paid 2 keep the rights etc cos theyve done all the work & u havnt (also it can protect the consumer aswell cos in theory its can stop inferoir product that cud b dangerous)ur product cud b a copy that u stole & u havnt done any r&d/work on it(for all they know u cud have stole it or doin sumfing u suddnt do)AS AGAIN ITS A VERY COMPLICATED FINE LINE!!!.
Trade marks were first b4 patents 2 stop other small companys making/using the bigger companys name/reputation etc(vice versa) 2 stop comsumers being conned into buyin products that wasnt made or approved by the bigger company(vice versa).
View loader was the first type of company 2 patent the
light sensor for that type of use(in the hopper neck 2 say when the paintball passes it(wayyyyyyy back in the eary day of when hoppers had 2 do sumfing 2 stop blockages,Sum used air 2 blow the blockage away etc but the veiw loader was the most popular)
But this patent is limited in the US thats why the Autofeed(uk made hopper) uses the same idea but different made products(not off the shelf)etc but its only 4 sale in the uk & not the usa.
Now the Halo is made in the usa so it its under attack,if it was made in the UK the mayb they cud get away with it but it cudnt b sold in the usa directly.
Ihope this goes 2 sum way of xplaining why patents etc r & 2 the complexity of it all.
If not ask me wot u dont understand & i can xplain it in more detail.
Ive had abit 2 drink so pls give me a bit of lee-way!
Patents r a PAIN,patents r limited2 certain things& THERE IS A REAL FINE LINE ON ALL THIS SO UVE GOT 2 GIVE A LOT OF LEE-WAY ON WOT I SAY !!! they only really started in the 40s-50s i think-shoes etc r not under this cos people have been wearing shoes,clothes 4 so long that it cant b done.
Trade marks & patents work in the same way.
If u make a product or logo u see the goverment type thingy commitee,where they have records of these things & they see if ur item is the same/relates 2 wot another company have paid 2 keep the rights etc cos theyve done all the work & u havnt (also it can protect the consumer aswell cos in theory its can stop inferoir product that cud b dangerous)ur product cud b a copy that u stole & u havnt done any r&d/work on it(for all they know u cud have stole it or doin sumfing u suddnt do)AS AGAIN ITS A VERY COMPLICATED FINE LINE!!!.
Trade marks were first b4 patents 2 stop other small companys making/using the bigger companys name/reputation etc(vice versa) 2 stop comsumers being conned into buyin products that wasnt made or approved by the bigger company(vice versa).
View loader was the first type of company 2 patent the
light sensor for that type of use(in the hopper neck 2 say when the paintball passes it(wayyyyyyy back in the eary day of when hoppers had 2 do sumfing 2 stop blockages,Sum used air 2 blow the blockage away etc but the veiw loader was the most popular)
But this patent is limited in the US thats why the Autofeed(uk made hopper) uses the same idea but different made products(not off the shelf)etc but its only 4 sale in the uk & not the usa.
Now the Halo is made in the usa so it its under attack,if it was made in the UK the mayb they cud get away with it but it cudnt b sold in the usa directly.
Ihope this goes 2 sum way of xplaining why patents etc r & 2 the complexity of it all.
If not ask me wot u dont understand & i can xplain it in more detail.
Ive had abit 2 drink so pls give me a bit of lee-way!
P.S. The makers of the Halo knew that they cud b under fire through the patent that VL have now owned by BE but they took the chance.
The reason why BE havnt sued earlier cos the Halo has 2 be for sale first cos the makers cud have just said that its a prototype(thats aloud aslong as there not usin BE parts without its permission) & aslong as they said theyd make the changes it needs 2 avoid being sued b4 its 4 the public/4sale.
The reason why BE havnt sued earlier cos the Halo has 2 be for sale first cos the makers cud have just said that its a prototype(thats aloud aslong as there not usin BE parts without its permission) & aslong as they said theyd make the changes it needs 2 avoid being sued b4 its 4 the public/4sale.
Agreeing with Styles, why would anybody in there right mind go to the hassel of manufacturing a product SOOOO similar to the marker leader. You know it's asking for trouble even thinking about it
Again, I don't think BE would have been able to touch HALO until it was on sale to the public. Now it is they are able to hammer there asses.
It looks like the HALO guys havn't done enough research into the competition, they've just shot themselves in the foot big time. Regardless of it being a quailty product or not
Again, I don't think BE would have been able to touch HALO until it was on sale to the public. Now it is they are able to hammer there asses.
It looks like the HALO guys havn't done enough research into the competition, they've just shot themselves in the foot big time. Regardless of it being a quailty product or not