A Problem with God

[Robbo]

Also being theoretical there are no right or wrong answers, merely different possibilities

Not actually true but I'll let it slide so we don't make this thread even more convoluted

 

[Duncan Berry]

Free will isn't the point here, it's the paradox that is the point !!!

Robbo mate i know its not the point but i was just trying to state that God would never allowed time and history to be messed with. at least in my opinion (provided God even exists)

i think though the whole time travel thing would result in a redundent timeline so to all effect that timeline in which the girls died never happened. now im not sure if you being the one that caused the timeline shift would have knowledge of the now redundent timeline or you would also have your memory wiped clear due to it never of happening.

On the other hand that action could single handedly destroy the fabric of the universe as some scientists have speculated.

 

[Robbo]

Robbo mate i know its not the point but i was just trying to state that God would never allowed time and history to be messed with. at least in my opinion (provided God even exists)

i think though the whole time travel thing would result in a redundent timeline so to all effect that timeline in which the girls died never happened. now im not sure if you being the one that caused the timeline shift would have knowledge of the now redundent timeline or you would also have your memory wiped clear due to it never of happening.

On the other hand that action could single handedly destroy the fabric of the universe as some scientists have speculated.

OK Duncan, read carefully mate; whether god would allow it or not is academic here because the paradox is theoretical and assumptions have to be made.

Talking about consequences of redundant time-lines is pointless here because we are trying to solve one particular problem and not open up another discussion that would only go to complicate matters.

And as for single handedly destroying the fabric of anything mate???
Come on mate........all that would happen is, the world would continue upon a different time line, that's all.

 

[egotistical]

I believe that if god does exist then he would be responsible for the creation of space and time. Therefore whichever theory prescribed to about timelines, is irrelevant as if god could create space-time then he would be able alter it to the way that he wants it.

 

[Duncan Berry]

ok sorry mate maybe i have been misreading this compeltely

And as for single handedly destroying the fabric of anything mate???
Come on mate........all that would happen is, the world would continue upon a different time line, that's all.

I was simply stating the theory that if you were to go back and alter time it may stop time altogether but fair enough that again is another topic entirely

i apologise and will re-read this more carefully

 

[Duncan Berry]

I am suggesting here, God cannot undo events that have happened, he can certainly rewind the tape to a place prior to the event and then another time line is embarked upon but then those girls still got killed albeit in the original time-line, it just got rewound to create a new one....you can talk about differing time-lines etc but if you think about it, these are still academic because the event still happened !!!

It seems as though God can't do everything...or can he/she?

OK what i see is your saying even if you went back and stopped the girls from being killed, they still died in another time-line.

now if that's the case talking about different time-lines I don't think is academic as if you believe in Parallel Time lines then yes the girls still die if only in another time-line and so it means God can not undo events that have happened.

But if you believe in a continuous time-line then no the girls didn't die as God wound back the tape and recorded a new story over the top of it and so those girls never died as the cause of there death was ended before he had a chance.


now if i have read it wrong again just tell me to shut the hell up

 

[Robbo]

I believe that if god does exist then he would be responsible for the creation of space and time. Therefore whichever theory prescribed to about timelines, is irrelevant as if god could create space-time then he would be able alter it to the way that he wants it.

Ego, you haven't understood the paradox mate...re-read and have another pop at it, the penny will eventually drop, I promise

 

[Robbo]

OK what i see is your saying even if you went back and stopped the girls from being killed, they still died in another time-line.

now if that's the case talking about different time-lines I don't think is academic as if you believe in Parallel Time lines then yes the girls still die if only in another time-line and so it means God can not undo events that have happened.

But if you believe in a continuous time-line then no the girls didn't die as God wound back the tape and recorded a new story over the top of it and so those girls never died as the cause of there death was ended before he had a chance.


now if i have read it wrong again just tell me to shut the hell up

Aha, now we are getting somewhere .....Yes, the girls did die in the original time-line and even tho the new time-line has them continuing to live, it still doesn't alter the fact they still died in the original...but there is still a bit more work for you to do here Duncan.

Whether I believe in continuous time-lines or parallel time-lines is still academic because I am saying he rewinds the tape that goes onto play out differently but is unable to completely eradicate the fact they died in the original, all he can do (or seemingly do) is change time-lines.

The fact that in the new time-line I am aware of what Huntley is gonna do is the reason the original time line doesn't take its original course (Coz I will kill him) but if someone were able to stand outside the respective time-lines, then they could still maintain the original time-line had those murders occur thus negating the first statement that god can do everything, and in this case, he cannot seemingly undo the fact they were killed, no matter what time line its in.
He can certainly undo the mechanics of them being killed by rewinding but not the knowledge they were killed somewhere.

 

[ReservoirFrog]

I suppose the only way is if God included himself in the rewind but still managed to change the event, therefore being unaware that any change occurred. It brings about another paradox in that 'can an omnipotent God make himself unaware of something?' but it's the only thing close to a solution I can see.

 

[Duncan Berry]

ah i kinda see what your getting at. So yeah i guess no matter what at some point the murders happened. And if you retain the memory of the action of reversing time, then it doesn't not matter if nobody else is aware that the events never ever will take place you will know they did.

so ultimately God would know and perhaps the person who committed the act of travelling back and altering the past. Provided there memory of what would now be there future (as they have travelled back) is not erased due to the fact of them stopping the events from ever transpiring.

so the answer is at least in my eyes is Yes god can change the past for the world but Not for himself, now whether or not that counts as him being unable to change the past is up for debate

that is at least my take on it