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Robbo

Owner of this website
Jul 5, 2001
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www.p8ntballer.com
Originally posted by Sid_Clan
Robbo, I have attempted to read a few of your posts over the last few days, my god man, you never just write a little thing do you ;)

But I have to say, for some reason all your recent post are bang on, tell it how it is no bull$hit, and I respect that.
Sid

Sid, if you care to read all my posts there is something co-incidental about them....they are all bang on :)

The only thing in question is whether or not people agree with them and that seems to depend on just how much grey matter they possess :)
 

Sid_Clan

What's the point!!!
Sep 13, 2005
401
0
0
God's Country
www.a1paintball.org
Originally posted by Robbo
Sid, if you care to read all my posts there is something co-incidental about them....they are all bang on :)

The only thing in question is whether or not people agree with them and that seems to depend on just how much grey matter they possess :)
Mate I have 5 kids and work for a living, there are not enough hours in the day to read ALL your posts....;)
 

niax

New Member
Feb 8, 2005
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please excuse me now if this post is rather unordered, i suck at planning rants

going back to the beginning of the thread - you go away for a few days and you miss out :S - having comming into the paintball scene just over a year ago, it was very daunting, sure walkonzone and this forum have aided the progression from "punter" days to walkons, but the gap between the two is still (having introduced some new players to the walkon level) quite large.

Even after a year i'm still having some issues getting used to the differences - and i'm almost one year in! The gap is so great that i actually perfer playing in "punter" days because the pace is easier and overall the day is more relaxed, agreed, i have recouped the initial outlay for all my stuff and i prefer playing with it than the tippy 98s

this brings me round to the primary problem with the walkon days. The levels of skill are very mixed, there are people like me that have little experience all the way to people that play regularly in tornies, the learning curve is so great that for the first few months i ended up just getting completly slaughtered (as expenced last month after facing team zone at the walkonzone walkon). i realise that new people can't have their own group, there simply aren't enough people to do it and that practice makes perfect, however to someone not as insane as me - they'll make the outlay for some stuff, show up one day and never come back.

well, that's me ranting on that topic over - back onto topic

dispite the huge gap between punterdom and walkon, the lines between walkon and tornie are so blured that it's hardly there, from what i see, walkons have become a small extention of tornie play - it's not that tornie paintball is filled with people that don't see it as a sport, it's has people in it that still see it as just a walkon

ok - rant over, come out of bunkers, it is safe again
 

PKNUTZ

Wordz
Originally posted by Robbo
Weedave I thought about it Dave but I gotta say, I have to hit the ground running in the 2006 NPPL and cannot afford to have guys on board that need to be trained up.
We have talent over here but guys who strut their stuff in the Pro League, PA and even Millennium soon find out their shortcomings when they get their asses on the NPPL scene, it separates the men from the boys in that sense.
And so, I had to go for players who had a proven track record of expertise and who I was confident could step up to the top level.

[
sorry if this has been suggested or sounds stupid:eek: but why not have a second squad just to play uk tournies for the players who may have the talent but not the experience to play the nppl or other us tourneys yet? it would be good for other uk teams to be able to compete against a second nexus team aswell as the giving the players the experience and training needed to play the us tournements . i dont see how the uk can produce great or pro players without guidance or training from someone as such as yourself unless there naturally talented :confused: sorry if that doesnt make sense . peace
Paul
 

Matski

SO hot right now
Aug 8, 2001
1,737
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I know of a kid out in Texas who has been playing for a month or so excess of a year. He is now very close to US pro standard - where he aint got experience..there's skill, aggression and game-vision to build on. Ok this is a year after training with some great players, but as just 1 isolated case in a big country - it dosn't require a great stretch of generalisation to see that the UK cannot compete with this kind of player production; Certainly not when most would rather show up to some little league event and spend the day beating up on teams like 'Uncle Bobs Prehistoric Ballers' than actually thinking about how they are playing. Infact, I think this is half the problem...UK players take tin-pot domestic 'tournaments' WAY too seriously- as tournaments...when in reality they are rec-ball events attended in most part by once-a-monthers. Nothing is gained other than whatever enjoyment from the taking part.
As said previously, our 'tournaments' and rec are blurred into some ****ty puddle...and for as long as they are - the only place potentially great UK players will come from is from training grounds attended by players who actually go there to change the way they play, share skills, and not to win some game worth nothing.
Makes for a ****ty talent pool if you rationalise things down. I think Pete deserves a lot of respect for taking the steps he has taken recently..it could not have been easy, but had to be done given the way that div is going to pan out.
 

Jasper

Northern Heroes #03
Sep 3, 2003
368
0
0
Carlisle UK
exactly whats needed

Originally posted by Chuck
So what can we do?

It's been discussed before but why don't we have Southern and Northern leagues with play offs between the two? teams can be promoted and relegated as they are within the PA, Millenium and the US series. At the moment the different leagues and series are just pulling in opposite directions which I believe is holding UK ball back. (the argument of competition being a good thing for the improvement of events is actually hindering the improvement of the teams).

I got shot down over this idea just a week or so ago as yet another series sets up :rolleyes: :rolleyes: http://67.19.5.132/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=53716 5 posts down 9 posts down by Shades empitamises it all in this country :rolleyes: Quote 'Sorry Jasper but I think your loosing sight of why most people play tournament paintball.' 'But and this is the big BUT, only a very small minority of tournament players enter or wish to enter these events. Most players just like the crack of playing GOOD all round tournament paintball, be it 3, 5, 7 or 10 person. Most people have a budget for there lecher activates so not having to travel miles to an event helps, and allows them to play more often. :rolleyes:

So basically no-one can be bothered over here if it costs to much or they have to travel is how it seems.

FFS i travel 140miles to train an over 200 to 300 to play just in this country.

A lack of a rec ball scene is not the problem in this country COMMITMENT is! :eek:
 

Nick Brockdorff

New Member
Jul 9, 2001
588
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www.uglyducklings.dk
Maybe I'm long in the tooth, I have been a player since 1988(and still crap) and almost three years ago myself and Peds opened our own site just outside Edinburgh, the site is owned and marshalled by The Clan team, 90% of my staff are in the squad, they all play tournaments and activley promote the sport of paintball during the day, speaking to customers, explaining about paintball as a sport, we have photo's of players in our safe areas, show customers tournament kit, magazines and so on. So, to that end I use my site as a marketing tool to promote paintball as a sport, and hopefully encourage new players, for example, Fi$h and Mak D(Bad Word) started playing on my site and were encouraged into tournament paintball, 60% of my squad started playing on our site.
Sid:

Every single field owner active on this website does that buddy - and still the conversion rates are horrible :)

What is more interesting - and at the heart of whether a field is good at converting rental customers to rec players is - what your employees and yourself say, when some kid says "I want to start playing paintball - how do I do that?"

That is exactly where most fields fail.

Paintball being a team sport (or pasttime if you like), there HAS to be an organisation in place to pick up all the rental customers that WANT to play regularly - but do not want the hassle of finding or starting a team - much less go out and buy equipment for a sport they are not yet certain they want to pursue on a larger scale.

There HAS to be an organisation in place at the field, that caters for the players that are between "rental customer" and "tournament player"

A field that wants to do this, needs:

- Field owned and operated "beginners teams" that are open to ANYONE

- Good quality equipment for rent

- Actual "training days" where the local "Pros" teach the new players paintball

- Preferably local events where the field teams in the area can enter

I think many field owners cannot see the forest for trees..... so imagine this:

If you went down to your local bowling alley, liked playing, and wanted to start playing regularly on a club level - what would you do?

Do you think the bowling alley would just say:

"Well buy your own kit, and we have some "open" days where you can come along and play" - and then that was it?

Well - that might be the answer - but not if that bowling alley was worth it salt and wanted to convert random players to steady players.

Nick
 

Nick Brockdorff

New Member
Jul 9, 2001
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www.uglyducklings.dk
I think most of you guys are all over the place in this debate - and talking a lot about things that have very little real impact, as long as your fields suck at converting rental customers to rec players.

Without a solid foundation - which is at local field level - everything else is just a different way of doing things for the already existing players.

:)

Nick
 

Robbo

Owner of this website
Jul 5, 2001
13,116
2,157
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London
www.p8ntballer.com
One of the main reasons I have gotten so involved in this thread and others like it is because of a total belief in the ultimate attraction of real tourney ball.
I say ‘real’ tourney ball because I am gonna distinguish it from what most of us over here indulge in because real tourney ball should be made of people who aspire to improve, who aspire to win and will dedicate themselves accordingly.
Our tournament scene is made of no such animals as I have suggested in other posts.
The demographic that goes to make up our tournament scene is more akin to occasional / armchair sportsmen who pay lip service to seriousness and commitment.

So what the hell am I offering here?
I cannot believe that the people who get involved in our tournament scene don’t wanna jump on the real tournament bandwagon.
But how does what I am advocating differ from what most of our tourney players are doing now?
As I have said, most of them are going through the motions; they get their gear bags from under the stairs about once a month, maybe wipe their marker down and trudge off to the Cleethorpes five man to run around a field pretending to be a paintballer.

We all should realize the score by now, I ain’t gonna labour this point no more but if these self same players could, just for one day, live the life of a pro player, I honestly believe things would change because the most glaring difference they would experience is one of satisfaction.
I use a pro player as an example because for the most part these guys are the ones who best exemplify what I am saying most ballers over here are missing.
The real and deep satisfaction a pro player will get is when his coach or maybe himself is told to practice a technique, maybe a snap shot; he goes away practices it..and practices it and practices it some more…… and then it happens……..he unleashes that practiced snap shot on an unsuspecting world and bam !
His new found skill begins to reap rewards….think about this because greater satisfaction is hard to find in any sport when a practiced technique translates itself into an armband being sliced off with a new found artistry.

I often use an actual example of this, it may seem an indulgent one but I promise it happened and I also promise it applies to any of you guys out there who read this.
When we developed our snap shot on Nexus, a lot of thinking went into its development, it looks simple but it took a few months to nail down the actual mechanics and get it practiced.
In our first year, we played Toulouse and I was standing on the line with Ollie Lang and Ryan Greenspam and Chuck from Dynasty, all four of us were watching Nexus play some German team when Jamie Abbott pulled off an unbelievable blind snap shot right in front of us all gogging the German chump which caused Ryan I think to blurt, ‘what the fcuk was that’?
He was impressed and at that moment I felt so proud of my team and what they had been doing to train that snap into the fabric of their play.
Jamie had executed exactly what we had all been practicing and it was instantly recognized by those Dynasty players as something special and trust me, that takes some doing to impress those guys and the player who did it had been playing novice ball just 6 months before.
If Jamie can do it, (in fact most of the team could do it at that time) then all of you can do it and it was this feedback of training, execution and results that became the bedrock for our training during that first year.
The positive feelings anybody can get because of this process is about the best thing you can feel outside of picking up trophies.
Sure, a lot of the guys can go play that Cleethorpes five man and in their own minds they can and do enjoy it but there is so much more to enjoy if they can just look from outside the box.
Training isn’t hard work if you wanna do it, and if you wanna improve and you enjoy getting results then trust me, you will WANT to train and this loop is what the majority of our ballers fail to appreciate.
You can play paintball and enjoy it on one level but competitive paintball when played correctly can offer up so much more than just ‘playing’.
It is a quantum leap in enjoyment and for those of us who have jumped on that bandwagon, it remains a tragedy that most of our tournament ballers do not want, or have no idea of, what they can be part of.
The Yanks ooze this type ethos, and we ……..hmmmmm …well, we all know how that one goes………I would love there to be some sort of academy of learning over here and I certainly would help out but I fear the uptake would be minimal at best and wouldn’t last, I would soooooo love to be proved wrong.
 

TheRenton

P8nt'in Yo Face Since 03
granted it might be a bit late, but some of us have started this method of constant training from lower division teams because we realise we ain't getting anywhere quickly by meeting once a month. So you are right what you say, but players and teams are changing, it's a slow evolvement but it's happening.