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Scenario games...

RePete

Imature member
Hello everyone. Please note this thread is not a flame or a troll. Just a question...

The question is, does anyone else find scenario games such the D-Day re-enactment on the front page of paintballchannel.com "disrespectful"? What are these games? A celebration? A re-enactment? A simulation? I'm curious what my grandfather, who fought at D-Day and the Bulge, and watched friends die, what he would say...I'm sure Tyger is used to hearing this question. It just made my blood boil.

There. That's done...Have a happy day everyone. :D
 

Darkwerks

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Oct 27, 2001
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I've been having much the same thoughts too. My Grandfather was a pilot in the RAF during the Battle of Britain. Many of the "D-day" type games say that they are honouring those fought in the war (Although it always seems to be the Americans who fought,everyone else seems to have sat that one out, but thats an entirley different thread:rolleyes: ) The D-Day game at 'Bunker Extreme', Wynadotte,Oklahoma, was started by the field owners to honour their dad who died in Normandy, or so I recall reading. They have a flag raising ceremony,a minutes silence, that sort of thing.
The problem as I see it is that if you honour those who fought,you are being indiscriminate, you honour both sides. And does paintball really need to be honouring the SS?
I'd like to take part in one of these games, because from all accounts they are one of the highlights on the rec ball calender, but I think I'd rather honour my grandfather, and the many others who fought and died to preserve my freedoms by respecting thier sacrifice. This isn't the way they would want to be remebered and there must be more reverential ways to do it.
 

kris

yarbles
Jan 10, 2002
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Just SoManc
you could also say that "saving private ryan" is disrespectful
At the end of the day it was made for viewing pleasure.
It is not a true account of what happened by any means. Yes the British did fight both the world wars thank you Hollywood:rolleyes:
and what about that daft program on BBC2 "trenches" or something.
I personally think you can never relive these type of events.
Its a weird situation because although i think that these events should have the upmost respect.
Is it disrespectful when people reanact the great battles of the middle ages for pleasure. I doubt it
What it does do is bring to the attention of the young that these events did happen. As long as they are explained at the start and young players are told of the dreadful deaths etc. And how about abit of the profits going towards a charity of the war victims.
What does make my blood boil though is when i hear of a film already being planned for "september 11th" Damn it a bit of time please hollywood. :mad:
 
Yeah, we should probably ban all those people who reanact old Civil War stuff, and tha Charge of tha Light Brigade and all that.

Having said that, my pet dog Foo-Foo got swallowed up by a Stargate once, so when I heard Wayne Dollack was running a Stargate scenario I was pretty pissed...
 

RePete

Imature member
Originally posted by kris
you could also say that "saving private ryan" is disrespectful
At the end of the day it was made for viewing pleasure.
Hmmm...I would disagree about "made for veiwing pleasure". I believe war films are made to tell a story. Soon those who fought in the war will all be gone (Well in a while anyway) and books and movies will be all we have to tell those of us who weren't there what it was like. Now as for Hollywood getting a store 100% accurate, that'll never happen.

Now what gets me about these war movies is people who are like "Did you see Saving Private Ryan?" or "Did you see Black Hawk Down?". "Yeah, that was so cool when...". OMFG. Yeah. Real cool...:rolleyes:
 
Roger that Romano...

in which case, nope, not in tha slightest. People die, **** happens - but if people find games like that offensive they should avoid watching tha Comedy Channel, cos pretty soon jokes about Nam and cancer and tha Trade Centre are gonna pop up...everyone's olds die of something.

As for what they are - they're just games, same as cowboys an Indians or Brits Vs Jerry, games that kids play. This is the same but with bigger kids...
 

Tyger

Old School, New Tricks
Ok, I'm looking now.

To be honest, back in the 80's when Grandpa Regan was in office, war scenarios were cool becasue it was like doing the real thing. Paintball reveled in the war image with fields like "Skirmish", "Sat Cong Village", and "War Games".

Now with the "sport" of paintball fighting for recognition, stuff like this is fodder for the media. At best, it's intresting. At worst, you have americans males, WHITE american males, pretending to be nazis, or VC, or some other kind of "enemy of the month club" member trying to "kill american soldiers".

Now for a moment, imagine 20/20 showing up to a scenario game and starting to question "German" soldiers. "Do you like killing americans?" "Do you like pretending to be a nazi?" All they need to find is ONE GUY in replical gear to say "Yeah." and you have a headliner.

I don't know about other countries, but the wounds from Vietnam are still fresh in a lot of minds here. When I see a bunper sticker that says Jane Fonda is a communist on a 99 Ford pickup truck, I know it's not healed. So when I see someone like Dollack make a scenario game based on events from the vietnam war, being played by kids (myself included) who have no clue what REALLY happened, it's blood money IMHO.

For some of you, TJ and kris, who say that it's harmelss fun I want you both to take a look at a few things. To just have an entertainment based on a war scenario is one thing. I can tolerate playing SC Village's "Germany", "Vietnam", "Beriut" and "Iraq" fields. But to recreate WAR is another. To even sell the game as a recreation of warfare is disrespectful to the men and women who died in the real battle.

Now if you said it was a war scenario, and every player hit would have to remain DEAD for the remainder of the game, you MIGHT get the same terror of the real thing. Hell some people might get off on that.

My kid does battle reenactments as part of rendezvous in the midwest. They love him because he dies so well. And when he dies, he STAYS DEAD. But what they are doing is recreating the battles so that people can learn a little of what happened. They can see how hard it was to actually shoot the rifles, get a decent shot in, how messy black powder shooting can look.

Scenario games are not reenactments. It's a cash cow for producers to hang their hats on to make money from the dead. I made a mistake going to a Vietnam scenario game, and left feeling disgusted at the scenario producer, the players, and the whole affair. I was expecting something diffrent, but the lack of control, and the lack of respect pretty much solidified my opinions.

And if you want more, I'll give it to you.

-Tyger
 

Tyger

Old School, New Tricks
Roger that Romano...

Originally posted by TJ Lambini
As for what they are - they're just games, same as cowboys an Indians or Brits Vs Jerry, games that kids play. This is the same but with bigger kids...
I have a bud, we're both into paper role-playing games and the like. Well, he's a 'Nam vet. He took a passing intrest in paintball, never did get around to playing. He saw one Vietnam scenario game writeup in a magazine I had at the time. He read it, looked disgusted, and didn't say anything else.

On the other hand, I've also met Vietnam vets who play these scenario games and do most, not all, but most of their old tricks. I met a guy who took 6 hours to crawl up to the opponent's base in the middle of the night. "Just like old times" he said.

Now if you want to know other people's opinions, I can direct you to a few people in cali who wear the scars from Vietnam who run paintball stores and fields. I can even direct you to someone that still gets phone calls from Uncle Sam asking for advice and occasionally asking him to come out to help with 'something'.

Scenario games aren't just "Games", TJ. If it were, I'd create the armies of "Zor" and "Zam" instead of the "Brittish 3rd batallian" against the "German 72nd batallian".

And I know I spelled it wrong. So what?

-Tyger
 

Baca Loco

Ex-Fun Police
Ok, I'm looking now.

Originally posted by Tyger
To be honest, back in the 80's when Grandpa Regan was in office, war scenarios were cool

To even sell the game as a recreation of warfare is disrespectful to the men and women who died in the real battle.----Scenario games are not reenactments.
-Tyger
I won't go quite as far as TJ on this one but scenario games aren't recreations or reenactments of any particular event. The "scenarios" in scenario games are rationales for 200 or 300 paintballers to get together in a big patch of woods and shoot at each other. And the vast majority of participants could care less what the rationale is; War of the Worlds, Alien vs. Predator, Waterloo or Waterworld. Those things are just the trappings of the game.
There's plenty of other more important things to be offended by the world. Just MHO.

Are you saying, Tyger, that if we elect a democrat next time there won't be any war scenario games? Or they'll be universally frowned on?

PS--didn't know you drove a 99 Ford pickup.:)

RePete--good to see you all getting American TV. Does it take 25 years to get down under?