EXL 2k5????

[Intheno]

so the success and efforts of the team have nothing to do with it?
If the success of the teams is down to the success of the leagues. Then why have an issue with them financing themselves with the sponsorship they work to get? Or are you saying you don't have a problem with it? Not quite sure....

 

[Nick Brockdorff]

Intheno

Are you saying that (for example) the NPPL, which needs sponsors to survive, should redirect that sponsorship to the teams?

No, I am not:

You are missing the point..... I'm not complaining about the present state of affairs.... I'm looking 4-5 years ahead... to a future where paintball DOES get big media coverage and attracts major bucks.

What I am saying is, that in such a future...... a 7-man/7-minute format will mean that the major sponsors will be attracted to the events..... whereas in an X-Ball/Z-Ball/Whatever-Ball format... the sponsors will ALSO be attracted to the teams.

I'm no begrudging the event promoters their buck, and had I been a promoter, I would most definitely back the 7-man format (it's the fomat that allows promoters to stay in control of the sport) - I'm merely saying that all the team owners out there that so readily jump onboard with the 7-man programme, are missing an important point in their thought process.... which is the long term perspective.

The next couple of years nothing much will happen, and most teams will be happy, because their situation will keep on improving. - After that, we will start to hear the first few team owners go "hold on a minute.... my team is still predominantly sponsored by in-industry companies, and most of the outside sponsors prefer to make deals with the promoters, because that is the best way for them to maximise their exposure...... something is wrong here".

HAD the teams stuck with X-Ball, they would be in a situation where the events were not the only safe place for a sponsor to get exposure.... the teams would also be fairly safe bets.... the longevity of the format is the key.

In any sport with a longevity similar to that of X-Ball, the league is either owned by the teams or some of the major sponsorships flow directly to the teams (others to the league/events)...... in any sport where the timespan of an atheletes, or teams, performance is like in 7-man paintball, the sponsorships flow to the event promoters.

It's a simple case of mathematics for sponsors, as in the 7-man format they have no way of knowing if Dynasty will be on tv for 30 seconds or 15 minutes..... whereas the event is sure to be on for the full duration of the show..... In a format like X-Ball, obviously the event will still get major sponsors, but suddenly Dynasty will be able to guarantee their sponsor a minimum of exposure through a direct sponsorship.

I fail to see how I am naive?

Nick

 

[Nick Brockdorff]

Jotajotaz

What is the difference between being one of the x teams that play the closed league called NXL or being one of the y teams that play the closed league called NPPL Pro? In terms of getting noticed it only depends on the success of each league. In terms of being "unique" it only depends on the success of the format (and you advocate XBall for all, so XBall teams should be another of the 100s teams at the festival...). I just don't see your point, in case you have one there

I'm talking about how major companies outside paintball value sponsorships.

It's about:

1. How much exposure they will get
2. Where and when they will get it
3. Who they are associated with when getting it.

Signing - for instance - Dynasty, will mean the sponsor is looking good on item 3. - As for item 2, that is all down to whatever media deal the event promoter has landed, and has very little to do with what format is played (both formats can be edited into an exiting tv show)...... but item 1 is the key to my argument.

- Dynasty has no way of guaranteeing a sponsor even a minimum of exposure in a 7-man format..... they can "hope", "pray", "think", "believe" or whatever... but when the sponsor asks "what do we get", the answer will be "time will show".

And THAT devalues the sponsorhip greatly for a professiobnal sponsor.

In the NXL or any similar league, teams will be able to guarantee sponsors a minimum of exposure that is a lot higher than in a 7-man format. - At least if the NXL is being professional about negotiating their media exposure, and do like for instance the NFL in terms of getting broad coverage for all teams.... but whether they are professional about, is a whole different story.... I'm merely talking about the virtues of one format as opposed to another.... not about the people that run the formats currently.

Nick

 

[PEBBLE]

Ronnie, Myth, GAFF

If X-ball was all that good why is there might not gonna be an EXL in 2005

cus 7 man rules

Word!

 

[Intheno]

Nico,
Either I misread your post or you changed your tack, I can't be bothered to re-read so I will give you the benefit of the doubt. Your 2nd post is only valid this year. The format changes and the new 18 pro league invalidate your argument of guarenteed coverage, but as you are not aware of the format change for Pro I suppose thats excusable.
Your argument would still be valid in reference to the Open Division, but you would expect the sponsors to look at the Pro league first.

I do look forward to seeing you guys in HB though. One word of advice. I believe the entries are going to be offered to last years teams first, and also to season ticket teams first. This will leave very little room for newcomers, especially for HB. Do yourself a favor and get in touch with Camille right away. The event will sell out the day registration opens and you reallly don't want to miss it.

 

[gaff]

Ronnie, Myth, GAFF

Originally posted by PEBBLE
If X-ball was all that good why is there might not gonna be an EXL in 2005

cus 7 man rules

Word!

yet another uneducated statement!

XBall is not continuing because our Euro and over the pond friends are not fullfilling their promises from a promotional level and the NPPL are taking control and directing the sport, but if INTHENO's cryptic chants are anything to go by, we may be playing a similiar format next season, or at lest the top 18 will (for which i will be gutted if we do not get the chance also!)

INTHENO: to answer an earlier question, my personal elegance is not with the PSP and XBall, it is with the type of format, the way the tournaments are structured (for the XBAll format) if PP and the NPPL are to offer a similiar structure/format but with the standard of show/event that they are doing already i will bow to the leader and offer my support for the game!

 

[Intheno]

I am pleased that you have personal elegance. Ever thought of a career in fashion?

 

[gaff]

Originally posted by Intheno
I am pleased that you have personal elegance. Ever thought of a career in fashion?

funny you should say that! the word is not that disimiliar to the one i meant to use!

 

[shamu]

Jotajotaz

Nick,

If you made these points in terms of an open vs. closed league, I might agree with you. Any closed, restricted access league will allow greater opportunities for promotion given the limited number of teams available (less competition for promotion/screen-time). An open league with variable numbers and types of teams would always be in flux and so harder to guarantee screen time.

However, I see no difference between generic Xball and generic 7 man if the league type is the same. although Xball games go longer, the double elimination-style tournament counters that benefit. In an open league-format, a team eliminated after their second game has no better chances for screentime than a team that doesn't make it out of preliminaries in 7 man.

Overall game time is less important than when that game time occurs. although Xball provides for longer games, those longer games are the same for everyone. If every team has 3 - 4 hours of game time, all that happens is fiercer competition for the coverage. I don't see this as significantly differently from every team having 28 minutes of game time.

Teams that are well branded (Dynasty) and successfull (Arsenal) will get screentime. Those that don't do either will get nothing. That's how competition works.

]

 

[Baca Loco]

Re: Jotajotaz

Originally posted by shamu
although Xball provides for longer games, those longer games are the same for everyone. If every team has 3 - 4 hours of game time, all that happens is fiercer competition for the coverage. I don't see this as significantly differently from every team having 28 minutes of game time.

Teams that are well branded (Dynasty) and successfull (Arsenal) will get screentime. Those that don't do either will get nothing. That's how competition works.

]

Depends on what sort of coverage is in play, don't you think, Whale? You are also presuming the competition "on the field" is the competition that matters and in that assumption you would be mistaken.

Currently the FSN NPPL clip shows have given bits and pieces of pro finals. Should that continue there's nothing there for even the majority of The 18 much less the "new" Pro division below that.

And by ITN's reading of the situation--in posts above--the teams are on their own and the NPPL is simply a (hopefully) high profile place for them to play and their "successes" will determine--perhaps--how truly successful they are.
The key point is that such an arrangement offers at best only a nebulous and secondary opportunity to the teams competing. The reality is that in this early stage there is no league without the teams and they appear to be selling themselves short. The biggest sponsors are putting their money into the league and if teams and players think there will always be sponsorship cash for them they are the ones who are naive. The NPPL is creating a new paradigm that, regardless of what they call it, is elevating the league above all else. The teams had better figure it out fast or be left to the dustbins of history.
Further down the road the teams comprising The 18 will separate among the haves and the have nots based on money--which will be even more important than it is today--and if the teams are strictly "on their own" you will quickly develop tiers of power and place and the competition will not be all the fiercer--it will decline--as the majority will simply not be competitive and introducing a couple of fresh teams at the bottom of the heap annually will change nothing.

Of course the NXL is hardly ideal either but not because the basic structure short changes the teams, rather the ruling ownership, in large part is, at best, incompetent and the league organization is too weak and poorly run to actually accomplish its purpose.

The real lesson of both leagues is if you aren't looking out for yourself nobody else is gonna be doing it for you [except me, of course, you ungrateful *******s ] and if you aren't asking what's in it for me and nobody is offering to tell you--the answer is probably nothing.