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Lowering of BPS limits - what say you?

Devrij

Sex-terrorist
Dec 3, 2007
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Does anyone think this'll filter down to local tourney level? If the big leagues adopt it will we have to? I'm a newb so forgive my ignorance :eek: My main (insert: selfish) concerns are paint prices going up (unlikely but possible) and any effect it'll have on the inter-uni league I play in.
 

dissent

New Member
May 25, 2006
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Did you people who think paint prices will go up graduate from Karl Marx University? Where did your understanding of capitalism and markets from from?

If the paint companies are selling less of a product than they used to, the smart thing to do is not to raise prices.

Dye says, hmm, DM sales are down this year. Let's increase the price!
HP says, hmm, laptop sales are down this year, I know, let's offer the same laptop as last year but at a higher price!

Or is it more likely that.... "holy crap we are selling every last pallet of paint we can produce, we are selling the paint before we can even produce it, let's raise the price."

Which of these scenarios makes more sense?

In the vast majority of all cases, the only time you'll see price inreases is because: there is too much demand for them to fulfill or their costs have increased.

If people started using less gasoline (translation for the Karl Marx U students - petrol), it is not likely that gas prices will increase. Rather, it is the sustained constant increase in gas consumption (among other factors) around the world that is increasing prices.

I can't think of too many situations where demand/consumption has dropped and the appropriate answer was to raise the price.

Now I don't know where the manufacturers are in terms of their production capacity, but the more something is demanded the more you can justify charging more for it. The less it is demanded, the harder it is to raise the price and it makes more sense to lower the price in order to stimulate more use.

Not that I think the rate of fire rules will decrease prices, they are probably near rock bottom. But economically that should be the most likely result of people shooting less paint.
 

Chicago

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Jan 31, 2005
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Whether the price changes and in which direction depends on WHY your sales are down. If your sales are down because buyers are not willing to buy it at the price you are charging, then you have to lower the price or go out of business. But if sales are down because the entire market has contracted, then chances are production in the industry will consolidate and prices will go up.

But, people need to understand that any difference in paint consumption due to change in tournament rate of fire is inconsequential to the industry at large. A lot more paint is sold at not tournaments (and not practices) than tournaments and practices.
 

dissent

New Member
May 25, 2006
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Chicago you seem to be suggesting that consoldation will bring higher prices due to a monopoly effect of some paint manufacturers going away. Less competition, less supply, higher prices.

That is a world of difference from I will shoot less paint, and therefore they will charge me more.

But in any case, if there does not appear to be a shortage of paint companies. If one of the bigger ones wants to raise prices, I'm pretty confident you'll see other companies carving out a niche as a cheaper supplier of paint.

As long as the paint company does not create a barrier to entry and prevents people from using other paint in the league I think we're probably ok.

As an aside, obviously the price of paint can fluctuate 3-5 bucks in either direction, but I don't see much more happening than that, and no where in the estimation of raising prices is the thought, "they dropped the rate of fire, we need to jack up the price."
 

Devrij

Sex-terrorist
Dec 3, 2007
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no where in the estimation of raising prices is the thought, "they dropped the rate of fire, we need to jack up the price."
Dude, we're not retarded. I just thought that if the 12bps thing filters down to the local level, then the effect of all the speedballers in world shooting 20% less paint could create a need to compensate for the loss in profit. Production costs don't go down very much with a drop in consumption. You talked about "gas" so I'm assuming you're in the states. Here in the UK things are expensive enough already. I'm not predicting a price increase (I even said I thought it unlikely), it was just in my head at that time. I'm only replying because I'm pissed that you thought anyone could be that stupid ^^^^
*deep breath* gooooosfraaaba.....sorry for flaming
 

Baca Loco

Ex-Fun Police
Devrij, got hair on your palms yet?

dissent--where'd you get your Dye insider info? :)

Couple of things-- 1. ROF isn't going to affect paint consumption in any significant way. Assuming a hopper volume of 180 F/A dumps a hopper in 12 seconds at 15 bps. Same load, same hopper at 13 bps empties in slightly under 14 seconds.

2. Coincidentally the PSP today announced sponsor paint only for next year's events which I read to mean the only acceptable brands at PSP events will be paint provided by league sponsors. One could argue who this is aimed at, players or producers, but within the tourney universe it does artificially constrain the "market". Will it effect pricing (at least within their closed tourney environment?).

As to Chitown's contrarian approach it's interesting because even as a company (or two) are plainly trying to squeeze the (paint) market I've noticed some small fringe players simultaneously trying to pick around the edges of the mass market with "new" products.
 

Inverted

New Member
Nov 18, 2007
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Totally agree with the 10/12 bps rule being put in place, with the exception of NPPL

Some people Want to keep it at 15 bps because they like the way it shoots WTF?!? What about all the gains can be made from having the rule in place.

paintballing is trying to move forward as a sport, and thats not going to happen if we stick to what we are used to.
 

evoonline

CPPS Referee 4 Life.
Feb 14, 2007
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Coincidentally the PSP today announced sponsor paint only for next year's events which I read to mean the only acceptable brands at PSP events will be paint provided by league sponsors. One could argue who this is aimed at, players or producers, but within the tourney universe it does artificially constrain the "market". Will it effect pricing (at least within their closed tourney environment?).
im confused *easily done*

does this mean you have to be sponsored by say draxxus or tomahawk *for example* to play the PSP ? if your shooting Zap then you have to change supplier or forfeit entering the league?