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Is Reunification still in the cards?

Chicago

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I guess I'm a little perplexed as to why we're even looking at NPPL/PP's failure to deliver out-of-industry support when PSP is in the exact same boat - although were it not for some people misbehaving in Texas maybe they would be up one major sponsor. And financially, neither league is doing well - although it does appear PSP at least has more people willing to dump in more money and more of it presently.

Another point of note is PP/NPPL *DOES* have the potential to take some actions that would drastically improve their financial situation. It'll change the product they offer a bit, but life goes on.

Speaking of product offer, I must stand corrected re: NPPL reffing. I had earlier stated that the reffing was bad because NPPL/PP wasn't spending enough money. After talking to more of the officials, it is clear that NPPL/PP is definitely spending the right amount of money. I'm not sure if spending the money and still having ref problems is better or worse than just not spending the money in the first place though.

If there's one area where NPPL/PP could make a lot of improvement without a big budget change it would be getting a strong reffing coordinator and giving them wide lattitude with the reffing program, even at the expense of hiring a few fewer refs to pay for it. (I also think the coordinator could pay for much of themselves by elminating some apparent financial waste in the reffing program.) There are still very basic things that don't happen on the fields - can't count the number of games I watched on very cluttered 7-man fields (nature of the beast) with exactly ZERO refs on the inside of the field. Even on the showcase field on Sunday, in the Pro finals, I'd expect to see somebody on the inside snake position. Two somebodies would have been appropriate given the traffic that area of the field was taking. That's just basic things that arn't happening. Apparently the money is being spend, so I can only guess that the supervision is lacking.


Back to the topic at hand, I don't think the situation is dire enough to cause a reunification. Maybe some more cooperation. The 'extreme' parties on either end (chuck/jerry) have been eliminated/marginalized, and the current ship captains (Ged/Dave) seem to get along well enough. Although it may not be intentional, a bit of cooperation is already happening - PSP and PP use the same vendor (PB Central) for their air. That should save both leagues money, and does so without reunification. I'd expect we may see more arrangements like that that benefit both leagues without forcing them to confront issues like common format or who owns how much of what post-reunification.
 

MissyQ

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Speaking of product offer, I must stand corrected re: NPPL reffing. I had earlier stated that the reffing was bad because NPPL/PP wasn't spending enough money. After talking to more of the officials, it is clear that NPPL/PP is definitely spending the right amount of money. I'm not sure if spending the money and still having ref problems is better or worse than just not spending the money in the first place though.
Chris, what qualifies you to determine what the 'right amount of money' is?
 

Chicago

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Chris, what qualifies you to determine what the 'right amount of money' is?
What qualifies anybody Owen?

Regardless, I should clarify that I meant 'the right amount of money given the amount of resources available to national paintball leagues in their present state'. Nobody can afford to pay the RIGHT amount of money.

As for what qualifies me, I'd guess something along the lines of running a profitable national league, with a profitable TV deal, and an out-of-industry title sponsor. And, my refs virtually always come back, if I want them.

I do have an advantage though - we run about 40 events a year all over the country, so I get a chance to find refs before I need them for our 'big' events, so I usually have a good pool of people to draw from. We pay more to bring a few select consistent performers in and hand-pick teams with reffing experience locally.
 

Robbo

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Missy, I think that tends to qualify Chicago's assertion quite well but it also highlights one of our very real problems in this industry, personal animosity predisposing people to opinions that have little to do with rationale.

A few years ago, I think I would have bludgeoned Chicago if I could have found him anywhere near a dark back alley and that line of thought pretty much blinded me to some of the things he was saying.
He most certainly used to have issues with bias and arrogance but I think he has genuinely cast these aside for the most part and the way I read his stuff now is altogether differently from how I used to.

If I could create a think tank to steer our sport and then give them complete control, I would have Baca, Chicago, Camille, Sergey and Dave YB as the fab five. I might even have Steve Davidson as a consultant to be called upon as and when, he has some great ideas and visions for our sport but he needs to be put on some sort of leash lest JB gets thrown to the wolves.
Having these five people control the destiny of our sport would in my head, ensure a reasoned direction that benefits all, and I mean all.

The people who hold the reins at present have way too many issues with each other as you know and this has proved obstructive thus far.
Still, as I mentioned in another post somewhere, finaces will now become the main dynamic for integration and adversity sometimes makes strange bedfellows.
I think 2007 will be an integrated season, if it isn't ... well..... someone's gonna be hurting.
 

MissyQ

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Pete, you're entitled to your opinion, but I don't think your 'fab-five' flys. Any group without Ged in it is weaker than one with him included. In fact, if I get Ged, I'll let you pick the other 4, and I would still consider my group the stronger one.
 

Baca Loco

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Pete, you're entitled to your opinion, but I don't think your 'fab-five' flys. Any group without Ged in it is weaker than one with him included. In fact, if I get Ged, I'll let you pick the other 4, and I would still consider my group the stronger one.
Can't we all just get along? And peeps wonder why reunification has faltered. It seems every possible related topic is only another excuse for division.:D
 

MissyQ

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Not division, so much as I am suprised that Pete (of all people) has detailed a 'top 5' that does not include anyone from Pure Promotions. In fact the absence of a member of PP is almost as surprising as the inclusion of Chicago....
 

Chicago

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You need Ged and Dave. Anybody else is just getting in the way, and if they come to an agreement, it doesn't matter what anybody else thinks.

Once they've decided to reunify, you'd want, in no particular order, Camille, Shawn Walker, Lane Wright, Bart W., Tim Schroepfer, Alex Elliott and Geoff to run various aspects of your unified league. There's some overlap there, but those are the people who know how to execute what needs to be done, including things that neither league is doing right yet.
 

Robbo

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Pete, you're entitled to your opinion, but I don't think your 'fab-five' flys. Any group without Ged in it is weaker than one with him included. In fact, if I get Ged, I'll let you pick the other 4, and I would still consider my group the stronger one.
I'm sure you would Missy but you must remember, Ged ain't my boss, he's your boss and so there is a fair degree of self-interest going on there, none of those mentioned is my boss, some of them are my friends and all of them I respect but Ged has now been involved in god knows how many integration talks with the PSP and Millennium and the track record doesn't exactly inspire confidence.
He is way too close to the problem to see it's wider perspective and it is key to appreciate the wider perspective here and not just what affects PP, WDP and the NPPL.

As a visionary, he is undoubtedly up there as I have noted many times before, probably more than anybody else in the press but when it comes to negotiation with people he perceives as adversaries then he retreats into a defensive mode that subverts any real chance of solution, thus far anyway and to be honest Missy, that's not really a point that can be contended.

Ged is smart, Ged has true vision, but if Paintball has to be sorted out from top to bottom then I would keep him on the back burner until it's all been sorted and then dust him off to come and help with promotion and direction because these are his strong suits as you well know.
 

Robbo

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You need Ged and Dave. Anybody else is just getting in the way, and if they come to an agreement, it doesn't matter what anybody else thinks.

Once they've decided to reunify, you'd want, in no particular order, Camille, Shawn Walker, Lane Wright, Bart W., Tim Schroepfer, Alex Elliott and Geoff to run various aspects of your unified league. There's some overlap there, but those are the people who know how to execute what needs to be done, including things that neither league is doing right yet.

Chicago, there have been many 'Ged and Dave' sessions and all goes swimmingly well until.......well you guessed it, until others get involved and then it all goes tits up ......