Is Reunification still in the cards?

[Milky]

Speeking to lots of the reffs in boston (alot on new face's lots of PSP refs coming over to try the nppl) they prefered the NPPL setup they were feed and watered (bottled) well. They said they will probable stay reffing NPPL and with rosie running the show it was definatly better than the beach and tampa so i think the reffing is sored. the carpet wasnt as bad as i think you have made out yes there were holes but small ones here and there the way you have writen it it sounds like the nppl red zone was tarmac. the players pit is in the middel of the fields i cant see how the NPPL could get them closer without potting up in the dead boxes

 

[Chicago]

"Lots of new faces" is the problem. Maybe not so much given Tampa, but the goal for reffing should be to have lots of the SAME faces from event to event, and that's how NPPL went from the best reffing in the history of paintball to the present reffing situation.


There are unquestionably things that NPPL does better than PSP, and vice-versa. Which is just another argument for reunification; combine the best of PSP with the best of NPPL.

 

[JtJ]

with rosie running the show it was definatly better than the beach and tampa so i think the reffing is sored.

Jeff: Rosie will not be working for the NPPL at San Diego.

the carpet wasnt as bad as i think you have made out yes there were holes but small ones here and there the way you have writen it it sounds like the nppl red zone was tarmac.

Jeff: The carpet on the Spyder field had a gap about 2 feet by 2 feet.

 

[MissyQ]

The carpet is an issue, for sure. There is no ducking it.
Of course, it became a much bigger issue when the reffing improved, but thats because people need to be able to complain about stuff, it makes them feel important. Hell, Chicago likes to complain about stuff even when he has never actually seen what he is complaining about.
I know that the NPPL is looking at improving the carpet, but if teams press them, I am sure they would offer to move to grass venues. Maybe that is the answer? I don't know. The crew that was fired in Miami did a terrible job of the Carpet, and the new crew have inherited a real mess. The turf that people like would cost around $4-500,000.00 Plus an estimated $40-50g per event to move it around - say another 200g for the first season. Its an expense that I don't thing the NPPL can sustain. Even if someone came in and presented the turf for free it ould not be practical to do. This stuff is only practical in a permanent setting.
So its transportable carpet, or grass. If it's grass then many venues become inaccessible. I personally do not know what the answer is. I know that the NPPL is allowing (and encouraging) more padding to be worn by the players for protection. That should help some, but while I again admit that the carpet is an issue (it would be for me if I was playing) and there are certainly people on here that like to bang the drum about it, whether they have played on it or not, I have not seen a. Any injuries, and b. many actual players at the actual event complaining about it. So while it is an issue, I am not sure how big an issue it is for the players themselves. I do make a point of asking players stuff like this, and they usually tell me that they don't mind the surface because they get to play 'at a place like this, in front of the crowds'. Perhaps they just tell me that because they want to be nice...

 

[Chicago]

It became a much bigger issue when holes started appearing in it. That this happened at the same time reffing improved from an all-time low is merely coincidence.

Don't confuse what I'm saying with complaining. I have pointed out the areas where PSP is currently superior to NPPL. Grass is clearly superior to carpeting on asphalt with holes in it. The problem is that you have an event staged on asphalt covered with carpeting with holes, not that I dare to point out that this is the case.

Maybe the solution is to invest in some padding to put under the carpet? And some new carpet?


As for asking the players, the problem is you're only asking players who are playing on carpet in front of stadiums. Of course few of those players tell you they mind - because the players that don't like playing on holy carpeting in front of stadiums arn't there.

 

[Robbo]

I know the devil is supposed to be in the details, but guys, the things you are discussing maybe symptomatic of the problem but they are hardly the answer.

FFS if the entire problem of unification could be reduced to a 2ft square of playing area then I'll go and fackin buy it myself.

Jeeeezus

The problems we have run a lot deeper than a half inch thick bit of green carpet.

 

[Chicago]

I know the devil is supposed to be in the details, but guys, the things you are discussing maybe symptomatic of the problem but they are hardly the answer.

FFS if the entire problem of unification could be reduced to a 2ft square of playing area then I'll go and fackin buy it myself.

Jeeeezus

The problems we have run a lot deeper than a half inch thick bit of green carpet.

On the other hand, let's keep in mind what reunification alone would fix and wouldn't fix. It would fix the drain on vendors. It would improve the finances of the new league.

But it, alone, would not change the fact that neither party understands what they need to do to successfully market paintball to 'the masses'.

 

[MissyQ]

On the other hand, let's keep in mind what reunification alone would fix and wouldn't fix. It would fix the drain on vendors. It would improve the finances of the new league.

But it, alone, would not change the fact that neither party understands what they need to do to successfully market paintball to 'the masses'.

Is that why they need you?
Are you the guy that understands how to bring paintball to the 'masses'?
You must be, otherwise you would not be claiming that the existing people don't understand how to do it. In order for you to know that they don't understand, you must surely know what they are missing. Isn't that what you're saying?

 

[SPHEREPOINT]

The fact of the matter is that both leagues are woefully flawed. It also seems that where one is strong, the other is weak and vice versa. It's like in 5th grade science when they told you that Africa and South America were actually one continent, then split. You find similarites in both, but at the same time, they lack what the other has.

The NPPL this season has had absolute moments of brilliance. As far as venues go, the beach and two NFL stadiums are hard to beat. The in/out carpet on HB sand played well. The typical Florida sand/rough grass mix at Tampa was just fine. The asphalt at Boston wasn't as bad as I was expecting, but it was still not anything I would have willingly played on. And there WERE injuries-ask the member of A-Team who dislocated his shoulder on Sunday-game stoppage and replay included. Boston was a great venue with a terrible playing surface, a case of sacrificing the heart to keep a pretty face. This is in contrast to PSP fields- all heart, but a face that was beaten with a bag of hot nickels. They have grass, and lots of it (it wasn't even burned and crispy in Chicago this year). PSP venues, almost without exception are not only off the beaten path, but aren't even located in recognizable places or near known landmarks! It lends quite a bit more credibility to the sport as a whole when the Chicago Open is in CHICAGO, not Bolingbrook. Everyone can find the NFL stadium in town, if they are a local or a visitor. Few can, off the top of their head, find the BRAC, or the BLAST or whatever acronym in nowhere the PSP is.

The PSP is gaining ground every day in organization and presentation. They are becoming a better league. The NPPL is maintaining and gaining on the precedent set at Huntington Beach 2003.The problem above problems is that both leagues are good, neither is great. This problem is due to factions, egos, and small picture thinking on the part of the few people who actually run the leagues, and for all intents and purposes, paintball. There is blood on all their hands, Billy, Adam, Dave, Jerry, Chuck, Ged, etc. Each has a conflicting interest in paintball league operation/promotion and business.
Reunification benefits the players, the teams, the sponsors, the vendors, TV, and the overall health and growth of the industry. It does not benefit the short sighted plans in each industry leader's mind, no matter how well intended that person believes those plans are.

 

[MissyQ]

good post for the most part Mr Point, I would add the following though.

After PSP Chicago the grass there was ruined. I have a girlfriend that lives in Bollingbrook 3 blocks away from that venue, and what was once green grass, is now destroyed. The NPPL had an option to go on grass in LA, but that grass would have been destroyed also. That would mean either a. Pay for it to be re-surfaced, or b. don't go back. Short term/sighted thinking would say lets just whack it on the grass. But that isn't the smart move.

No-one has blood on thier hands, les not get carried away, If you know the full history and story of the leagues for the last 10-15 years then you will know that the progress that has been made since 2003 is incredible. Money is what holds things back, not the people running the leagues. If both leagues had enough money, they would fix the problems they have immediately, that goes for the PSP and the NPPL. No-one has short-sighted plans. You need to give the people in both leagues a lot more credit than that. It is these people that have raised the bar in the last 3 short years.