Time to face the music and dance Mark and Headrock

[Mark790.06]

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
Well, just off the top of my head, perhaps it would be a good idea to stop selling components of WMDs to every dictator with a cheque book and a grudge against a country we don't like.

End trade with dictators, ok.

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
Training fundamentalists to fight against countries without getting our hands dirty? Not a good idea in retrospect either.

Fight our own battles, good.

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
Trying to play kingmaker in the middle East and furthering our own interests rather than co-operating with the existing climates?

Leave in power and cooperate with Saddam, Usama, Arafat, Kohmeni, Omar, Kaddafi, Assad, and Faud, gotcha.

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
Running the risk of inflaming things, lets take your comment: "allowing terrorists to work, train, and live in their midst doesn't make them wholey innocent either". Hate to point this out but we all have terrorists in our midst, but I feel no more personally responsible for those people making Ricin in Manchester than I hold you accountable for funding the IRA.

Key word was allowing, and the closest you got to having a point was US citizens funding the IRA. Do we allow terrorists in our midst (Europe does whenever Arafat visits), had you known would you have allowed ricin to be made in Manchester. Assuming your answer is no, then no, I don't blame you for it.

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
Take Timothy McVeigh - did the USAF carpet bomb his home state to eradicate the terrorist threat? Seems that the only time we haul out the ordnance is when the brown or yellow people start getting beligerent.

Was the governor of his home state harboring terrorists, did they have a WMD program and a history of invading neighboring states?
Ask a stupid question, get a stupiderer question back.

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
"Corrupt arab governments" - if your definition of "corrupt" would include denying 40,000 people their right to vote or lying about fulfilling their election promises, then we both have to look a little closer to home on that score too.

Not that I recognize your claim, nor do I even care to argue it, but what does that have to do with Arab governments denying the rights of ALL people to choose their leaders, along with denying ANY rights to one half of their society, and supporting terror to name but a few?

Originally posted by Jones the Paint Magnet
It's an old truth that it's easier to criticise our own faults in others. Sadly our approach to other countries is to deny we're at fualt at all, it's just them to blame and carry on very much as we have been doing for decades. No time machine needed, just a bit of common sense and understanding.

That's funny, because you seem to be doing the exact opposite, and if there are no absolutes in life, then we are not totally to blame, just as they aren't totally blameless. But at least my finger points only a little more towards the East. Your finger seems to be stuck pointing towards the West like a busted compass. We HAVE made mistakes in dealing with the middle-East, not the ones you claim we have, and not even close to the quantity, but mistakes nonetheless.

 

[JoseDominguez]

Not exactly on topic, but related.

WHY THE HELL AM I GREETED BY PICTURES OF SADDAMS MUTILATED SONS WHEN I SIGN ON TO AOL?

For christ sakes, why not put their heads on stakes? What purpose are these images serving? Do we all have to sink to that level? Not too much different to dragging a corpse throught the streets really is it?

 

[Jones the Paint Magnet]

Well to show my compass works in at least two directions I'd guess that it's an attempt to shatter the morale of the forces currently resisting and ambushing the coalition (cut off the head and the body dies) and to shore up support from the locals who are understandably worried about the key leaders not being found, and cruising back into power with a grudge if/when the coalition skedaddles.

But no, it was a pretty gruesome spectacle - as war generally is.

 

[stongle]

Whilst I'm somewhat Ideologically opposed to both Jones and Jose (war is muchos muchos good for business here), I think (whilst I can sorta understand the reasons behind this), it is pretty appalling. Me, I haven't seen the pictures and would rather not. But what I think is worse is Rumsfield on TV whooping it up cowboy style. With his "bet ya ass, we killed them varmits, shot em full o lead yeee-hah".

I mean I was sold on the war just to kick Saddam's teeth in, but I'm now starting to wonder if "stranger things are afoot".

 

[JoseDominguez]

I'm not directing this at either country, and I'm not getting involved in the whole pro/anti war thing again. It's the media that are doing this....... just because the photos have been released to them, wtf are they thinking, printing them? "warning these photos are gruesome" too bloody right..... I'm not bothered by the images......I've worked in path labs.....it's the fact that these images are been shown in mainstream media. Why should kids have access to this?
Nothing to do with my opinion on their deaths....... an eye for an eye is fine by me (shame he didn't have another few thousand family members) it's the fact that these images are now public access.

 

[headrock6]

Originally posted by JoseDominguez

WHY THE HELL AM I GREETED BY PICTURES OF SADDAMS MUTILATED SONS WHEN I SIGN ON TO AOL?

You mean you guys didnt get these pictures scattered all over your newspapers??Yesterday morning all three of the major newspapers here had them on the front page..Now while I could definately do without them being shown anywhere but in Iraq,once the media gets hold of em,you know there gonna show it...And as im watching the news right now,supposedly some sort of video is being released..Ill let ya know when I see it..

But I actually think most Iraqis wanted the proof as they've heard 6 times the sons were dead and then magically reappeared time and time again..Is this good for the Iraqi people??Sure..But even with the pictures its been hard to prove..Last I heard,6 outta 10 Iraqis were still a little hesitant about the pictures..Many Iraqis have called for a public showing of the bodies..

But are they good for anyone else??Not necessary at all...

But what bothers me most is that this isnt US policy!!Its gonna make it very hard in the future to ever tell someone not show our dead soldiers or bodies on TV..Maybe we should have just let the Iraqis come in and poke and prod them and take thier own pictures instead of this...

 

[JoseDominguez]

That's what i was thinking........bloody horrible isn't it. Takes away one more bit of our moral high ground.



Headrock.......my pm list is acting up..... but you can e-mail me (I kept getting bounced messages a while back)

 

[headrock6]

Originally posted by JoseDominguez



Headrock.......my pm list is acting up..... but you can e-mail me (I kept getting bounced messages a while back)

I was berating the French and tried three different times but it kept saying it was full so I gave up ..Call me lazy..

 

[JoseDominguez]

sorry I missed that.

Oh, and I'm moving that we make an official alteration to the definition of the word 'racism' just need to add the words 'except of course when directed at the french'.

 

[headrock6]

Didnt miss much..Had to do with the US boycott of French products..Seems wine sales are down 30%,tourism is down 25% and businesses are calling for Chiracs head for such strong opposition to war...Also remember,this a country where a neo-fascist got 20% of the vote at last elections

There releasing a video of the bodies...Rueters is reporting they've been shown the bodies and there reporting that it looks like them,the dental records are a match,and that they possibly had facial reconstruction..They also said theres no proof that Uday commited suicide..Sick stuff indeed..Straight outta a James Bond flick..

What I dont get is why the US didnt invest in a Mach 3 and shave these f*ckers down..It woulda helped...