I'd have thought a move back to proper Xball would be a good idea, a lot of people are tuning into the stream now and it'd be good to see a format with halves and has a fixed (ish) length that's better suited to broadcast timings.
PSP ROF for 2014!
- Thread starter Stephen
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Financially is Xball viable for anybody but those who get their paint for nothing or practically free?
I've always seen the race-to format as analogous to stoppages in American football or ice hockey: geared more towards allowing advertising between the stops in the games so as to maximise the advertisers bang for their buck.
I've always seen the race-to format as analogous to stoppages in American football or ice hockey: geared more towards allowing advertising between the stops in the games so as to maximise the advertisers bang for their buck.
I think the move to 10.2 is being driven as much by the industries need to control the cost of the PSP pro division (the teams dont pay for the paint, the manufacturers / sponsors do) as it is by the desire to make the game more action packed. The teams will play a similar style, but will shoot almost 20% less paint. [Insert counter point about more people getting shot less and staying alive longer in points and consequently shooting more paint in total as a result of lower Rof here] But no matter what you say the maximum amount of paint that can be shot in a match will come down and so will the average as a result.
Thats not insider knowledge, just personal opinion.
Joey Blute likes to make contradictory points as it means people notice him, but what I do like about what he says is the 'give us halves' argument. You will still see the majority of teams who go 2 or 3 points up going on to win matches, but you will see more teams trying to chase games down in the 2nd half of matches, and some of them achieving it.
I think ultimately if it is successful it will filter down the divisions as a standard format, this is why divisional players are up in arms. But if they really want to kill off the slow games some one needs to figure out an easily repeatable method of making field layouts that reward attacking play and severely hamper a team who plays 5 guys in 'the pocket' (the area immediately around the start gate - back centre and 1 bunker either side) and try to just stop the game.
A simple solution might be to mark out an area - call it the pocket - around the start gate and say that every team must always push at least one body outside this area off the break every single point else they get a 1-4-1. You can add in extra details such as in the first 5 minutes you have to run 2 bodies outside the pocket to try and prevent games from starting out really slow and cagey. (although personally I like that aspect as its like two boxers sizing up their opponent in the first round of a bout)
Whether it works or not time will tell, but fair play to the PSP for constantly trying to tweak the format and constantly giving the teams new problems to solve.
Thats not insider knowledge, just personal opinion.
Joey Blute likes to make contradictory points as it means people notice him, but what I do like about what he says is the 'give us halves' argument. You will still see the majority of teams who go 2 or 3 points up going on to win matches, but you will see more teams trying to chase games down in the 2nd half of matches, and some of them achieving it.
I think ultimately if it is successful it will filter down the divisions as a standard format, this is why divisional players are up in arms. But if they really want to kill off the slow games some one needs to figure out an easily repeatable method of making field layouts that reward attacking play and severely hamper a team who plays 5 guys in 'the pocket' (the area immediately around the start gate - back centre and 1 bunker either side) and try to just stop the game.
A simple solution might be to mark out an area - call it the pocket - around the start gate and say that every team must always push at least one body outside this area off the break every single point else they get a 1-4-1. You can add in extra details such as in the first 5 minutes you have to run 2 bodies outside the pocket to try and prevent games from starting out really slow and cagey. (although personally I like that aspect as its like two boxers sizing up their opponent in the first round of a bout)
Whether it works or not time will tell, but fair play to the PSP for constantly trying to tweak the format and constantly giving the teams new problems to solve.
But Ash, there seems to be this constant stream of talk about how to make the game more interesting, how to get new people into the sport and how to avoid the slow, technical points which probably aren't of much interest to a newcomer. By adding additional rules, wouldn't the gap between those who have no previous experience (newcomers) and those who are already involved with paintball (almost always players or previous players) just be exaggerated, essentially making paintball even harder to understand by those who haven't played before? Kevin Coulm's new blog actually said something along the lines of "If there are only Paintball players at tournaments, it will remain a small audience, which will stop the outside sponsors to jump in." (http://drompaintball.blogspot.fr/2013/12/hi-everyone-we-decided-to-run-blog-for_16.html) and my personal opinion is that that seems pretty bang on.
To me, it seems that any changes that are being, or have recently been implemented, are done with the goal in mind of attracting new players and driving the sport forward. I absolutely don't doubt that there is some other agenda on the go industry-wise, however I just don't personally see a more complex variety of paintball (I'm thinking Formula5 and again, that's just my opinion of F5) really doing anything to grasp people or make paintball better.
It's also interesting to read Axel's interview in the new Grip magazine as one of the questions put to him was "What are the main differences between the PSP and MS?". His reply suggests that Pro PSP players tend to react a lot quicker as a team and individuals causing the play to be slowed down a lot whereas in the MS, the style is very much to get up to the 50s and gunfight. p95-96(http://www.grippaintball.com/no8/) This almost would make you think that an actual ROF change could make a difference but I still just struggle to see it affecting the main teams much. Is it wrong to maybe just think that the slower, more technical play style is simply the evolution of the Race format at the very highest level and such a style simply just hasn't been achieved yet in Europe?
Either way, halves seems like the right step forward to me. As Ash pointed out about the 3 point difference generally leading to the team that's up, winning that point. A proportion of that has to be down to the mentality the losing team gets in. It'd be really interesting to see how the best teams in the world react when the same thing occurs, but instead of them only having so many points they can "give" before game over, it's down to time and how they can rally themselves before the beginning of the next half. Regardless, it's good to see some change and whilst I do think the Xball halves style would be better, I can't exactly say I dislike watching teams trying to slow play points and make intelligent moves. It adds an intellectual level to the game rather than just "who can blaze down the field the quickest as many times as possible".
But yeah, I really don't think the ROF change is going to make much of a difference at Dallas.
To me, it seems that any changes that are being, or have recently been implemented, are done with the goal in mind of attracting new players and driving the sport forward. I absolutely don't doubt that there is some other agenda on the go industry-wise, however I just don't personally see a more complex variety of paintball (I'm thinking Formula5 and again, that's just my opinion of F5) really doing anything to grasp people or make paintball better.
It's also interesting to read Axel's interview in the new Grip magazine as one of the questions put to him was "What are the main differences between the PSP and MS?". His reply suggests that Pro PSP players tend to react a lot quicker as a team and individuals causing the play to be slowed down a lot whereas in the MS, the style is very much to get up to the 50s and gunfight. p95-96(http://www.grippaintball.com/no8/) This almost would make you think that an actual ROF change could make a difference but I still just struggle to see it affecting the main teams much. Is it wrong to maybe just think that the slower, more technical play style is simply the evolution of the Race format at the very highest level and such a style simply just hasn't been achieved yet in Europe?
Either way, halves seems like the right step forward to me. As Ash pointed out about the 3 point difference generally leading to the team that's up, winning that point. A proportion of that has to be down to the mentality the losing team gets in. It'd be really interesting to see how the best teams in the world react when the same thing occurs, but instead of them only having so many points they can "give" before game over, it's down to time and how they can rally themselves before the beginning of the next half. Regardless, it's good to see some change and whilst I do think the Xball halves style would be better, I can't exactly say I dislike watching teams trying to slow play points and make intelligent moves. It adds an intellectual level to the game rather than just "who can blaze down the field the quickest as many times as possible".
But yeah, I really don't think the ROF change is going to make much of a difference at Dallas.
Good post Frobinson. Blog post by Coulm was interesting, and very true. I will be checking that out more often
Also, pleased to hear I'm not the only one who enjoys the slower points Besides, a quick point is only a quick point because there are slow points. Imho paintball would be very dull if every point lasted less than 60 seconds. Not that I'm expecting 10.2 bps to have that effect on the games anyway.
Also, pleased to hear I'm not the only one who enjoys the slower points
Besides, a quick point is only a quick point because there are slow points. Imho paintball would be very dull if every point lasted less than 60 seconds. Not that I'm expecting 10.2 bps to have that effect on the games anyway.
With regards to xball halves, all that keeps coming to mind is the way some of the NCPA games went last season and seen some teams take an absolute thrashing that were impossible to come back from. Yes statistically if you are up 2 or 3 points in a race format you are going to win, but when it passes the stage of a possible comeback, you are just sending teams out to the slaughter as they become more and more desperate while running down the clock (now would that drive up paint costs for the sponsor?).
Plus we can't deny that there is plenty of examples of teams making incredible comebacks in the race format while down points (for example the ton ton - heat game from bitburg which was just re-released on socialpb) which i think is more intense and exciting to watch than hoping that a team can slowly claw it back if they are down 4 or 5 points in an xball match.
edit: just for my own interest, i looked at how the scores progressed in one of NCPA finals games, and the team that won with 10 points on the board, were the ones that took the lead with 3 points in the beginning.
Plus we can't deny that there is plenty of examples of teams making incredible comebacks in the race format while down points (for example the ton ton - heat game from bitburg which was just re-released on socialpb) which i think is more intense and exciting to watch than hoping that a team can slowly claw it back if they are down 4 or 5 points in an xball match.
edit: just for my own interest, i looked at how the scores progressed in one of NCPA finals games, and the team that won with 10 points on the board, were the ones that took the lead with 3 points in the beginning.
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@Liam92 I don't deny that that sort of thing can happen with xball halves. But remember, we're not talking about some kind of mixed level division here, we are talking about the absolute best of the best. If you go watch Heat vs CEP from Dallas this year, Heat confidently won, however that didn't stop CEP fighting back to get at least another point back. And I wouldn't even consider CEP as a top tier pro team. At the end of that game (7-2) there was over 8minutes still left on the clock. Given that CEP were able to fight back when they were 4 points down, even just to get a point, you can't help but wonder how they could have done with a little more time.
25minute halves like in the NCPA would be a little extreme, but surely 10minute halves would be possible?
And thanks Jack. I do agree though that short points are only considered short in comparison to the slow technical points. I'm not sure I'd enjoy watching pro paintball as much if it was continuous fast points. Either way, I don't think the ROF change will have the effect they were hoping for and I don't know if format is the answer but it definitely seems like a more applicable solution than 10.2bps does.
25minute halves like in the NCPA would be a little extreme, but surely 10minute halves would be possible?
And thanks Jack. I do agree though that short points are only considered short in comparison to the slow technical points. I'm not sure I'd enjoy watching pro paintball as much if it was continuous fast points. Either way, I don't think the ROF change will have the effect they were hoping for and I don't know if format is the answer but it definitely seems like a more applicable solution than 10.2bps does.
Full xball is great to play however it made for a difficult transition for my team in the PSP. We are used to being down 4 points then smashing a team once we establish our momentum and rhythm. I feel race2 does not give a real indication of who the better team is because you have the same give guys out the majority of the time and with the 2 mins between points they can do that. You want to test the athleticism and depth of the team, drop it to one minute and then you are forcing more player rotations. I really think the 10bps is just a waste for the pro division for this year.
My dad watched some of the psp webcast, he said it was boring. He watches cricket.