NXL is dead, long live the NXL

[Chicago]

Originally posted by Missy Q

Chicago, a few hundred K won't even pay your full-time staff. You need $2 million for your first season outside of what the events themselves will generate, and you know what, no-one wants to do it.

So someone please put up or shut up. Chicago, call the NPPL and feed them these magic leads so they can pursue them. Don't sit there and talk about them and how they are out there waiting.
If you can't, and they don't exist, just say so. I won't give you a hard time. I promise.

You do need $2 million above what the events will bring in, but you don't need that to come out of your pocket - you need a few hundred K to get the couple million. It's also possible to get on TV with no money at all, but probably not on a major network without some initial investment.

As for giving leads to NPPL, why would I do that? They've got entirely the wrong structure to do this. I'm trying to figure out how to use the leads without letting the industry screw it up. I'm closer than I was last year.

Whatever brings us forward, it's not NPPL, and it's not PSP, or NXL. You can't do it in a manner that half of the industry feels excluded and sets out to sabotage you beause of it.

 

[Missy Q]

Nick, I believe you are completely accurate in your last post. No arguments from me on that. There is nothing wrong with your idea's or your desire to see them implemented. I am just calling for a reality check.

Chicago, Things aren't that bad. I for one would be very happy if the PSP/NXL got a major TV deal. PP would definitely be thrilled. All manufacturers would too. If breaking the sport open is the universal goal (and it is), then I don't think anyone cares who does it. If someone else does it then great. When it happens everyone makes money. The PSP get a deal on NBC, it's successful, the NPPL will then have a better deal waiting on Fox. Thats what happened with Poker. NBC and FOX are far more competitive than the NPPL and PSP could ever be. Its human nature, and it's healthy.
HOWEVER...
To hold back leads which in your opinion could improve the chances of outside investment, and then cry for unity of the industry and better outside sponsors is ridiculous. Seriously mate, listen to yourself.
........unless that was just a way of deflecting my 'put up or shut up' comment, in which case it didn't work....

Oh, and please tell me how to turn a couple o hundred G into 2 million bucks, I am quite prepared to put my house on the market if you can give me that particular secret!!!

 

[Chicago]

You can't turn a couple hundred G's into 2 million bucks for your pocket, but you can turn it into 2 million bucks to spend on something that the people giving you the $2 million want you to spend it on.

As for withholding leads, I'm not crying "industry unity". I'm crying "industry get out of the way". None of this works when manufacturers run the leagues. They're no good to NPPL. Hell, they're really already available to NPPL, there's no rocket science in it. The fact that they havn't managed to capitalize on them just illustrates the problem: NPPL isn't set up to take advantage of out-of-industry support effectively.

I'd give 'em to Sergey. Or Doc. Maybe even Pev. If Dynasty and Infamous and XSV and Naughty Dogs got together and formed their own little collective, I'd give the leads to them too.

But NPPL and NXL have already pissed on enough opportunities. I'm not giving them to NPPL because I know all they'd manage to do with them is screw it up.

 

[Missy Q]

so instead you do nothing.
sorry Chicago, but thats pathetic, and virtually prohibits you from moaning about how other firms try to make things happen, because the operative word is try, which denotes effort.

And sorry again, but the money thing makes no sense either. If you were able to do this, you would have done it. The firm you work for would have backed you. The fact that you have not given the leads to your employers is also very strange, and more than a little disloyal in my opinion.
You are the king of bold statements with no backbone. There is no substance to anything you say. Its all smoke and wind.
Give the leads to Doc? Great idea. Give the lead to some trust-fund kids with only thier own personal gain in mind, thats great too. Give it to people with no infrastructure to implement it. In fact, all the people you mentioned giving it to are in a worse position than the existing leagues to deal with it. Oh, and name some opportunities the NPPL has pissed away. Or are you just blowing smoke there too?

You know what? I think you are bull****ting. I may as well come out and say it. You make generalised sweeping statements, outrageous assumptions, and make no attempt to back them up.

I give up on you. You are not the astute industry insider I mistook you for.

Please add this to your sig.

"I make statements I can't back up, so please don't ever ask me to prove anything I say, as I am unable to, because I actually talk bollocks half the time, and Missy busted me for it".

have a great weekend

 

[Chicago]

What made you think I work for someone in the industry? Maybe I do, maybe I don't, but that's just an assumption on your part.

Maybe I am doing something about it. Maybe I am totally bull****ting. Fortunately, neither depends on whether anyone believes me.

It's obvious you love NPPL at the moment. That doesn't make them the right people to do it. I'd trust the greed of a few "trust fund" kids to do what is right for the sport as a sport over the greed of someone to sell more stuff any day of the week. If the teams think they're going to make a bunch of money, we're probably headed in the right direction. That's the way sports work.

If you think Chuck et. al. has anything OTHER than his own personal gain in mind, ask him when NPPL, "paintball's only players league", is going to have elections. What does Chuck do, anyway, other than pocket $100,000+ of ID card money every year?

I have my own fish to fry and my own bills to pay. If I could figure out a way to get, say, 8 people who have TEAMS together in a room and act in their own best interest without the industry mucking it up, and without becoming homeless myself in the meantime, I'd do it in a second. I havn't figured it out yet. 8 teams acting in their own best interest are going to do the right thing for the teams. Chuck and Bart are going to do the right thing for them to try and prevent teams from making all the money (the way sports work), same with Billy and Adam and Jerry and Gino. These guys ALL benefit from the status quo.

A league where the vast majority of the money comes from people like Coke and McDonalds and worst of all Nikie and the vast majority of the exposure goes to Coke and McDonalds worst of all Nike and the priority is making the biggest number of people watch it so more people see Coke and McDonalds and worst of all Nike, now making paintball sports apparel, probably is not preferable for Chuck, Bart, Adam, Billy, Dave, Gino, Jerry or Rennick. Well, it IS preferable to what they have now, but they all think its worse than if they can keep control of everything themselves. Nike could walk up to NPPL or NXL tomorrow and offer a few million and these guys would probably say no - because a few million from Nike means they're screwed.

If you want to change it so you get a lot of money from Coke, McDonalds, and Nike, the people you want to put in control of that change are the people who are going to benefit from that change the most. For Ollie or Sergey or Telford or Robbo or Doc, it is absolutely, positively preferable to change where the money comes from.

What happens when Dynasty's budget is 90% Coke instead of 90% Smart Parts? When the Arsenal gets more money from Toyota than WDP? When Lasoya starts cashing checks from Nike instead of National? That scares the **** out of the people running NPPL/PSP/NXL.

That's why you gotta get the industry out of it. Taking paintball to the mainstream is easy. Taking paintball to the mainstream without compramising your manufacturing or distribution business is hard. If we want paintball to go mainstream, you have to put people in charge who don't have manufacturing businesses.

 

[Missy Q]

Taking paintball to the mainstream is easy

YOU ARE ON MARS.

These guys ALL benefit from the status quo

Rubbish. Everyone benefits from the opposite of this.

If the teams got together and did it, broke the whole job open, then the manufacturers would be very happy. If Nike picked up the Dynasty tab, Smart parts would be thrilled. Same goes for Arsenal/WDP. Someone else picking up the tabs is what everyone wants. More product gets sold, less money is given away, these are good things. You have a very odd perspective of what the industry wants. The industry wants to make money, not give it away. It wants a return on it's investment. o you value the money that the industry has already invested in competitive painball so little? Do you think the industry is currently 'making out'. Wow!

The teams don't have any money. It takes money to do stuff. Your plan always falls down at the same point. A plan has to be implemented. That requires expertise, infrastructure, talent and funding. The teams are good at playing paintball, and that isn't one of the skill-sets required.
Thus, you are talking bollocks again.
Thus, please hurry up and modify your sig.

and I didn't make any assumptions. I have you worked out. If I remove the hot air, you have an idealistic theory founded on mainstream sports with few tangible comparisons to paintball, with no way of putting it into practice, and none of the essential elements I mention above. Hopefully you will prove me wrong, but I seriously doubt it.

Hence I flat out disagree with your ethos on the basis that to get to where your Paintball Sport Utopia exists you cannot do without the efforts of the existing leagues. For the teams to make money they need fans. To get fans they need a forum. The forum is the event schedule. The event schedule is facilitated by the industry.
Your comparisons to the NFL are unrealistic and more than a little naive. We are talking about paintball. There have been a plethora of threads on here highlighting the differences so I won't waste time explaining them to you again. In fact, enough wasting time. Its Friday, and I am going to Vegas with the sisters for the weekend....

 

[Missy Q]

oh, and shame on you for the usual name dropping of Nike, Coke, McDonalds etc. I would expect that from the kids, but seriously Chicago, get real for a minute will you. try to make an argument without using buzz-phrases and re-hashing the same old crap

examples of buzz-phrases

'Big outside sponsors' (this includes naming them)
'TV deals'
'Professional athletes paid big money to play'

instead of doing this, try decribing the means to reach them, and try to do this without just taking a pop at the industry, as without the industry, you would be pretty screwed wouldn't you? Try frying fish and paying bills in Paintball without them.

This time I'm going for real

 

[Baca Loco]

Brave New Pball World -- PGi 189

Originally posted by Chicago
8 teams acting in their own best interest are going to do the right thing for the teams.

As I recall back in the day when ITN roamed these forums and was chiding me for being relentlessly negative (a spurious charge, btw) and wondering when I might offer some positive contribution this is precisely what I suggested but if any of the pro teams have explored such an option they is doing it on the way down low.
Most of them I'm familiar with are more engaged in isolated efforts to support and promote themselves as they are looking for ways to be more independent and self-sustaining.

 

[Missy Q]

Loco, I heard that after the last PSP event your team was being excluded (unfairly in my opinion) from the new players league. They just can't afford that kind of bad publicity...

...so I suppose that explains it....

and ITN is still around. Some fool busted his identity on here, so we have to do without his pearls of wisdom and curiously accurate insight.