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headrock6

Bloody Yanks!!
Jun 5, 2002
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Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by Baca Loco
1--so let's hear the Neo-Realist interpretation of the positions of say, France, Germany, Russia and China
Easy...Oil contracts,played the anti war card to win re-election,9 billion in loans,and when was the last time China hasnt abstained from a U.N. vote(well 1441 but no one wants to live up to that resolution so....)
 

Baca Loco

Ex-Fun Police
Re: Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by headrock6
Easy...Oil contracts,played the anti war card to win re-election,9 billion in loans,and when was the last time China hasnt abstained from a U.N. vote(well 1441 but no one wants to live up to that resolution so....)
Call that an answer, 6? Just scratching the surface. And only superficially correct. :p Wait'll you see Hotpoint go to town.
 

headrock6

Bloody Yanks!!
Jun 5, 2002
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by Baca Loco
Call that an answer, 6? Just scratching the surface. And only superficially correct. :p Wait'll you see Hotpoint go to town.

Does this mean I get to witness a Hotpoint-Baca duel on international foriegn policy???Makes me wonder why Im even spending $60,000 on an education:confused: :p ;)

-6
 

Cube

M2Q'd eblade or the LV1...decisions, decisions
May 4, 2002
920
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Warrington
Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by Baca Loco
if Hotpoint had his way there'd be a government bureau telling you when to flush the commode and how much petrol you're alllowed to consume.
Baca we do have a government bureau that tells us how much petrol we can consume

The Treasury :)

They tax the living **** out of us so your take home earnings are crap and then have tax on petrol so high it's pump price is at 82p per litre you can't afford to use much fuel so by default.......

BTW 82p is about a $1.30 so that's what £3.72 a gallon or $5.92

War! What is it good for? putting up petrol prices and letting governments with 80% tax earn a few more quid:mad:
 

Hotpoint

Pompey Paintballer
Re: Re: History

Originally posted by knobbs
I *LOVE* this argument. Apparently, GW was not supposed to be president because he didn't get a popular vote, even though he was voted into office by the laws of the US government. I guess a majority vote is supposed to give you whatever you want, huh?
You misinterpret what I and other people mean by this. By US Law GWB is legally President but that is because the United States is not a Democracy in the strictest sense but rather a Republic that holds periodic elections

You can only claim to have been Democratically Elected if you got more votes than those you were running against. If not then you clearly lack an electoral mandate regardless of the Legality under which you hold the position

Interestingly this anomaly is present in other Countries that have FPTP (First Past the Post) Electoral systems. The same happened twice in the UK with the Conservatives under Churchill winning the 1951 Election with less votes than Clement Atlee's Labour Administration and Harold Wilson (Labour) beating Edward Heath (Conservative) in one of the 1974 General Elections again despite getting less votes

Originally posted by knobbs

The rules don't work both ways, buddy.
I think you've got this backwards. The hypocracy here is a man who was not democratically elected preaching the virtues of democracy. Lets face it that's just amusing :D
 

Hotpoint

Pompey Paintballer
Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by Baca Loco
1--so let's hear the Neo-Realist interpretation of the positions of say, France, Germany, Russia and China
Well first of all it is in the long-term interests of all of these states to have a stable global system in which to operate. If the United States is allowed to dominate and ignore laws it does not agree with just because of it's military superiority then we not not have order we have anarchy

Secondly each of these states wishes to have influence in the world but this is threatened by US Military (if not economic) supremacy. All would benefit from a United States that had less ability to steer events in its own favour

Thirdly France and Germany are democracies and the vast majority of the people in those countries are opposed to the war, this will tend to mean that Politicians looking towards the next election will seek to find favour by following the public mood

Fourthly China in particular is attempting to expand its influence globally and could do without the United States having a strategic foothold on every continent

I could go on and on but I think thats enough for now ;)

Originally posted by Baca Loco

2--the issues are frequently black and white; it's the motives and the players that are shades of gray
Name half-a-dozen issues in International Politics that you think are purely Black & White and I'll have a go at proving otherwise

Originally posted by Baca Loco

And, no, you're not gonna suck me into this Party rally masquerading as a thread. :D

Be very careful, Stee-Vo, if Hotpoint had his way there'd be a government bureau telling you when to flush the commode and how much petrol you're alllowed to consume.
Was ever a man so misjudged? :( ;)
 

Hotpoint

Pompey Paintballer
Re: Re: Re: Re: Pot and kettle

Originally posted by Baca Loco
Wait'll you see Hotpoint go to town.
I aim to please :D

Originally posted by headrock6
Does this mean I get to witness a Hotpoint-Baca duel on international foriegn policy???Makes me wonder why Im even spending $60,000 on an education
Another Hotpoint-Baca duel is well overdue. Watch the count of how many people drop in to watch, quite the spectator sport in these parts :)
 

knobbs

New Member
Sep 16, 2002
336
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www.teaminfected.com
Re: Re: Re: History

Originally posted by Hotpoint
You misinterpret what I and other people mean by this. By US Law GWB is legally President but that is because the United States is not a Democracy in the strictest sense but rather a Republic that holds periodic elections

You can only claim to have been Democratically Elected if you got more votes than those you were running against. If not then you clearly lack an electoral mandate regardless of the Legality under which you hold the position

Interestingly this anomaly is present in other Countries that have FPTP (First Past the Post) Electoral systems. The same happened twice in the UK with the Conservatives under Churchill winning the 1951 Election with less votes than Clement Atlee's Labour Administration and Harold Wilson (Labour) beating Edward Heath (Conservative) in one of the 1974 General Elections again despite getting less votes



I think you've got this backwards. The hypocracy here is a man who was not democratically elected preaching the virtues of democracy. Lets face it that's just amusing :D
I don't misinterperet a thing. It's just a bull**** argument.

The fact is the man was elected president of the US in the way we elect our presidents. If the US is not a "Democracy in the strictest sense" it is still the closest thing the world has to one. Last I checked, there were no laws that limited a President's power when depending on how many votes they got. A President's job is to get **** done. What you and others like you are saying is that because he did not get the popular vote (or, even dumber, and OVERWHELMING portion of the popular vote) the guy has no right to do anything. You would make him a lame duck.

The fact of the matter is this choice (and, coincidentally, nearly everything this president has done) has been supported by a majority of the population of this country. Democracy in action, my friend. The fact that the media is liberally biased doesn't change the actual percentages, people have supported the things that are being done.

If everything is supposed to be decided democratically, then it shouldn't matter who the President is, you should just do what the majority of the citizens of the country want, right? Well the majority of the citizens of the country agree that we should go to war with Iraq. But wait--you don't agree so all that goes out the window.

The truth is, we elect these people because we trust them to run our country, not because they are puppets at our whim. ("Hey, 80% of the US wants to nuke Jamaica. Guess I gotta do it.") Funny enough, we have an electoral college for the same reason. Our government is built on a system of checks and balances, so that even though every person in the country doesn't vote on every decision the government makes, the interests of the people are protected. It is unreasonable to hold a vote for every decision, so we vote for those leaders that share our concerns and views and let them vote on those ideas. That sounds like the most realistic way to carry out a democracy to me.
 

ABBA

wanted like a bed sore
May 28, 2002
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well this is fun, i was just wondering if people see the (possible) war with iraq and the war on terrorism as one and the same or not? If not is it just coincidence that we wait 12 years to attack iraq, or could it have something to do with hurt feelings from sept 11th?
Also, is everyone as impressed with france as i am? i didnt think they had it in them!!! - watch the news and you'll hopefully see what i mean! :eek:


NB, I'm trying to get an passionate response, i'm not insensitive to all the lives lost on sept 11th, its like all the public lives lost through terrorist attacks in the name of irish freedom.