The 2nd UK Federation Meeting

[Dark Warrior]

In reference to Biscuit's post, maybe the board should actually look at tournaments in general. Woodsball and Sup-Air tournaments ARE NOT mutually exclusive and some form of alignment would be beneficial to both arenas. Considering the board is mainly industry based and board members in the majority have played both formats, is this not something that needs careful consideration.

Remember the majority of players in SupAir have come from Woodsball and there are a lot of ex SupAir players playing Woodsball tournaments. My view is both models need to be structured, in doing that, then players will have a balanced choice and the tournament scene in general will benefit.

 

[Biscuit]

polly all i was trying to say was maybe running,woodsball at the side of this end of year event would maybe bring along players to watch this new product,that the board are trying to produce,and possibly convert guys from the walk on/woodsball tournie scene to sup-air ,just a thought as we need new blood and maybe building bridges between both scenes would be a good idea.i might be talking crap but hey nothing ventured nothing gained

 

[custard cavalier]

will there be a players rep on the board?

 

[Tommy Gun Nexus]

I play, does that count?

 

[Robbo]

will there be a players rep on the board?

I think Tommy has responded appropriately but....I am there for the players ... that's one of the reasons why I got involved in all this, and just because I don't play anymore, I don't think this disqualifies me from representing all players.

And if you feel it does disqualify me, then Tommy is an extremely competent alternate.

 

[chrizwheatley]

I dont really like to make posts on topics such as these in fear of reprimand, Robbo you seam a intelligent and sensible man so by all means if my post offends please feel free to delete it with my apologies.

The problem we face is quite clear and detailed many many times by people more knowledgeable and educated then myself but i will try and sum up in 'council estate' words why and how i feel tournament pb is declining and how i think a good start would energise the industry.

So ok i havent been playing paintball as long as a hell of a lot of you guys and i am starting to work out how it works. It seems whomever has the most backing does well and continues to do well at the expense of the newer players.

I will pick for an example boxing as something to compare against as people kinda understand that far more and robbo you will more then likely be fully versed in.

Players feel intimidated by big events against people from all over the country, they do not believe they are "good enough" to play at this level. Kinda like a boxer he knows he has all the moves sparing with palls in a gym and thinks to himself well maybe i could have a few local rounds with like minded people. Of course there is many gyms that will be more then willing to do so. the Difference lies there with paintball, this (in pb world) costs money and usually a higher amount then it would do if you played a well planned and organised event. What players and teams need is a foot to the big events and i think wendy had a great idea with KOTH but to me that sounds (dont meen to offend) "gimiky", what paintball needs is a proper footing div 1 2 3 4 etc etc and until you win at whatever level you do not progress, in boxing you go all the way through amateur to make it pro once you reach pro you are supposed to be at top of the game, so why would a pro fight a nobody? Money and feel good factor and the lad at the bottom of the pile is made to look silly when he is out boxed and looks like drunk fool with windmill arms outside a bar.

I have had a chat with wendy regarding how we (my team) want to play an event and she is happy with us playing at a level we are happy with until we become more consistent so we opted for div 2 until we win it before we move up kinda like how a boxer would go through amateur ranks before becoming pro we want to develop as a team before "fighting" the top boys.

The emphasis with paintball is to be top of the 1st div in as little time as possible, and i think more thought should be given into how to bring fresh blood into the game as apose to how to keep the top dogs happy, thats how you get value for money, it would be a lie if i said i didnt like playing against teams that are not above my level because of a easy win however in boxing terms i would not like or choose to fight a person of lower ability in the hope of making the guy look bad and him not wanting to continue with something he before hand loved and i think this is where paintball goes wrong. I have heard and seen many times the horror story ... high level teams walk over and bang an extra few into new players and teams for the "they are mint" kinda comment, however this is wrong and this is what intimidates people and scares off new players.

My honest opinion is that all teams should be tret equality and get the same back as they put into it. Dont just keep the top dogs happy encourage the top dogs to keep the new teams happy in hope they will one day themselves do the same. There seams to be a hell of a lot of 'attitude' in tournament pb, what it needs is a mother figure who says you done well even though you didnt win and you will not be forgotten for next time as apose to a father figure that says that was crap dont bother again. A suggestion here, why not ask the guys whom sponsor teams to ask their teams to mentor new teams at events and show them the ropes? I myself have missed a dinner time chat to go onto a field and show new players how to shoot a marker and how to lane paint etc and i am FAR from a good player, so if i can and will do it why dont the top dogs without them getting something for it as i believe they get enough from sponsorship anyways?

Anyways my post as always is long winded and not quite what i ment to say but to sum it up, we need to have the means of bringing new teams into the lime light without fear of a lashing (like NSPA does - an academy), where good teams are made from the bottom up and this can only be done by the guys at the top who seam to forget the n00bs. What needs to happen is more 'academy' or local sites be supported and structured / networked not just top of the game events.

Hope i didnt offend anybody and if i did please except my most sincere apologies

 

[Biscuit]

like what the uspl is doing in the states.you get a pro player for an event to coach and help you with advice

 

[SimonGiles]

It is great to see the federation moving on and gathering a bit of momentum. Good luck fellas - I really hope you can make some head way. The fact that the federation exists means UK ball is in a better place that it was beforehand.

I don't want to start dragging another thread this way and that, but there is one more point that I think crucially needs thinking about, ... and goes back to the heart of woodsball vs supair, nostalgia etc, ... and that is the arms race.

I know it has all been said before, but, when I started 'balling half a box of paint would do me all day - even in a tournament (and I would have paint left to take home). As a teenager back then, I struggled to afford that - but managed. I would play maybe 8-10, 20mins games. A lot of ballin' by today's standards.

Then came semi's, then came ramping. I totally agree that the modern game is great, BUT, half a box of paint now lasts me less than a minute and a half of pulling my trigger. That is not value for money. And that fact is possibly going to kill the sport (just like all those old diehard pump fans said it was going to).

The credit crunch is now exasperating the problem.

If the federation can align rulebooks and leagues that's great. But if paintball is truly to survive maybe it is going to need something more fundamental ??

I am not advocating a return to pump play (although maybe that would be a solution ).

I would love to know if this issue has been discussed at fed level, and what you guys are thinking.

Concerning going back to the woods - lets remember why we came out of the woods :-
1) You cannot marshal it effectively (fields too big / too easy to cheat).
2) Games can be decided according to who gets what end at the start.
3) It's too easy to bust parts of your anatomy when trying to run through the woods.
4) Most games would end in a stalemate after 20 mins of slinging paint across the field.

Supair has brought us fields that are symetrical, can be effectively marshalled, are accident friendly, and that result in a win for the better team (not a stalemate). For those reasons alone they are the way forward.

However, playing supair does not mean having to shoot 12-15 balls a second at each other.

Dave hosted a pump day at the D7s site sometime last year if I remember, and I heard that everyone had loads of fun there.

Combine supair fields with guns with drastically reduced fire rates, and we may get fun, cheap paintball that everyone can enjoy, and that as a sport can grow. It's not what the Americans are doing - but does that matter ?

 

[Robbo]

I
The problem we face is quite clear and detailed many many times by people more knowledgeable and educated then myself but i will try and sum up in 'council estate' words why and how i feel tournament pb is declining and how i think a good start would energise the industry.

Chriz, get your ass down to the Elephant and Castle in South London, pop round the back of East Lane Market, into Bronti Close and you'll see two big-ass blocks of council flats ........that's where I came from ...... I hope my point's made mate.
There is no reason anybody's posts will be deleted unless you are attacking people or breaking the rules, neither of which you are doing, and so, your post is very welcome ...even tho its origins are the same as mine

 

[chrizwheatley]

Great we are on the same wave length, the rest of my post i believe is something that could be looked at and maybe discussed in better ways then incorporated somewhere in pb world within the uk where smaller training sites and academy type venues be networked up with some big support from the guys at the top.

Thanks