Thoughts Please ...

[Echowitch]

There is that transition yes Chris. In my office our company has an incentive, (we are an incentive/loyalty based company its our main business but this is internal stuff for staff,) where if you do X (I forget what) you get a free days paintballing on the company. I spoke with the guys in my department who had done it and had mixed reviews. My Manager wimped out (his own words lol) after getting hit in the hand, but everyone else was interested in doing more. However me telling them about my pass time, and showing them a few pictures from the last Freekz tournament had them all raring to go do it again.....well except for our boss.... because they'd never heard of Sup'air. Sure they'd seen the bunkers setup at Tower Paintball but figured it was just another scenario game. But they loved the look of the cool gear, the description of the speed and intensity. I even tried to persuade my boss to come along by offering to let him use my Ego and we'll all have site Piranha's

However unless a site has a Sup'air setup you won't know about it. I've been playing for 16 years, including playing Hyperball on sites that had it but knew nothing about the Sup'air tournament side of things until Bluey from the Carebears told me about it. (Cheers Bluey) And some of the punter sites I've come across have tried to put me off the Sup'air side of things, and have gone really frosty when I've told them I play it. Which doesn't bode well for us trying to get people to move across from the Woods to the bunkers. Although Chris as you know, our two front boys were Woods boys until they met us

Going back to my company again though, I went and offered my services to HR, offering them advice on sites to go to, and being a general point of contact about paintball in the office. They told me a load of people were eligible for the reward but few people took it up as they knew nothing about it other than it was running around in camo's and it hurt. There's a distinct lack of information out there for new people, and a lot of the Scenario players prefer to stay with their thing. (They prefer the style and its cheaper as well.)

There needs to be more info out there, and I don't mean the Delta Force numpties trying to sell tickets in the street who've never actually played and don't know what they are talking about. Some people and teams have managed to get interviewed and pieces published/broadcast in the mainstream media which is great but they still see us as a bit of a fringe group.

Its the younger crowd that we need to aim for. All the kids where I live know what I do at the weekends, (they've seen me taking my gear out of the car and asked what it is,) and they are all interested in playing. Only problem is most of them are 11-14 and don't have the money for it. I have warned them of the upside and downsides of it and let them know the truth about the whole "it hurts" thing, so they are prepared.

 

[Madcowman]

Thats a prime example - I'd like to think that the guys who played ( with great gusto I might add ) in the freakz tourney made the transition from the woods to bouncy castles without any problems.

how do you mass promote it though ? One of the biggest crossovers in paintball is at the big games. Which is tradionially where speedballers get to don some camo and hit the trees. Would it be a good idea to encourage our realtree clad bretherin to try somethign with a little less trees ?

 

[MJ]

I just had a thought. People are going on about how not enough fresh players are coming through and people dont have the knowledge/information about how our beloved game is played. I guarantee if you ask people in the street what there interpretation of paintball is they would say it hurts. We need to inform them and get them into watching tournaments and supair side of things so they understand that it doesnt REALLY hurt but its the buzz and adrenaline that makes it so fun, and being a unique game all the more interesting.

I bet your thinking how can we do this without loads of money being put in o marketting. We cant and we can not expect random people to come and watch a game they dont understand, so why dont we offer them some alternatives whilst our tournaments are playing. A few posters, internet posts in the right place, family members and general word of mouth, a few local tournaments LOW COST and the chance of a FAMILY FUN DAY OUT. They bring there family where there are burger stalls, games. Maybe a donkey (geographical position applys (blackpool)) Like a fun fair where we can entertain the public whilst one of our tournamens are in process. They will see it and again hopefully be intrigued creating more and more people being interested in it, Maybe even gpoing as far as renting equipment for say £10 giving them paint and all the kit and letting them have a go. This has got to be good publicity for our sport and maybe a possible idea into getting the public intrigued.

It was just an idea that popped in to my head (i attended my younger sisters school funfair and it made loads, maybe an interpretation of this like a circus or something to attract the public) and i thought i would relay it to you guys.

Might be way off lol but hey if its new blood we want then the answer isnt with sponsors within ourselfs but the possibility to gain interest from outside our sport.

oh by the way my "T" button doesnt always work and i apologise for bad spelling lol.

-MJ

 

[Jon C]

I just had a thought. People are going on about how not enough fresh players are coming through and people dont have the knowledge/information about how our beloved game is played. I guarantee if you ask people in the street what there interpretation of paintball is they would say it hurts. We need to inform them and get them into watching tournaments and supair side of things so they understand that it doesnt REALLY hurt but its the buzz and adrenaline that makes it so fun, and being a unique game all the more interesting.

I bet your thinking how can we do this without loads of money being put in o marketting. We cant and we can not expect random people to come and watch a game they dont understand, so why dont we offer them some alternatives whilst our tournaments are playing. A few posters, internet posts in the right place, family members and general word of mouth, a few local tournaments LOW COST and the chance of a FAMILY FUN DAY OUT. They bring there family where there are burger stalls, games. Maybe a donkey (geographical position applys (blackpool)) Like a fun fair where we can entertain the public whilst one of our tournamens are in process. They will see it and again hopefully be intrigued creating more and more people being interested in it, Maybe even gpoing as far as renting equipment for say £10 giving them paint and all the kit and letting them have a go. This has got to be good publicity for our sport and maybe a possible idea into getting the public intrigued.

It was just an idea that popped in to my head (i attended my younger sisters school funfair and it made loads, maybe an interpretation of this like a circus or something to attract the public) and i thought i would relay it to you guys.

Might be way off lol but hey if its new blood we want then the answer isnt with sponsors within ourselfs but the possibility to gain interest from outside our sport.

oh by the way my "T" button doesnt always work and i apologise for bad spelling lol.

-MJ

in theory that is a good idea but i can already see aflaw in your plan. This is the paintballers themselves, you cant invite familys to watch you lot be whinging pri madonnas, overshooting each other swearing, shouting and for a want of a better term being d***s. Unless the players grow up we will always struggle to attract new players.

Unfortunately this season it has got worse and worse every round. At STR i had refs on my field being told their c***s,pr**ks, out of there f**king mind for pulling a 1-4-1 etc, what a great family enviromement this is.

 

[OddJob]

People are going on about how not enough fresh players are coming through and people dont have the knowledge/information about how our beloved game is played.

That is interesting as when you mentioned playing paintball competatively no one has a clue. Marketing is something that is an interesting prospect, but as people are starting to think about is how.

you cant invite familys to watch you lot be whinging pri madonnas, overshooting each other swearing, shouting and for a want of a better term being d***s. Unless the players grow up we will always struggle to attract new players.

Amen to that, but this may not just be about the sport but symptomatic of a general decline in respect in society. However, with fierce rules and punishment then this can be combatted in sport. Being kicked off the field for foul language would mean money wasted on entry fee and therefore hit people where they notice, in their wallet.

Certianly this could have the knock on effect of stropping about not playing that tournament series any more which is naturally what is hoping to be avoided. It's shame as there is so often a positive, happy vibe between a lot of ballers.

Woodsball: no no, it's too hard to take pictures in the trees

 

[Echowitch]

in theory that is a good idea but i can already see aflaw in your plan. This is the paintballers themselves, you cant invite familys to watch you lot be whinging pri madonnas, overshooting each other swearing, shouting and for a want of a better term being d***s. Unless the players grow up we will always struggle to attract new players.

Unfortunately this season it has got worse and worse every round. At STR i had refs on my field being told their c***s,pr**ks, out of there f**king mind for pulling a 1-4-1 etc, what a great family enviromement this is.

Agreed, I've made it a point of saying to my guys that we are playing to have fun, and that they don't cheat, don't swear, and respect the ref's and if they have a problem they bring it to me and then I'll take it to the ref's.

I've recently seen a player get shot fairly, argued it, swore at the other player, stuck his finger up at the other player and throw his marker on the ground in a tantrum walking in to the deadbox. And this particular player wants to play the Millennium series........good luck pal, you'll get thrown off field after your first match no doubt. I know we play an 'aggressive' game but is it really neccesary to act like Harry Enfields Kevin character. "I HATE YOU......ITS SO UNFAIR."

Seriously grow the F up !!!

 

[pestilence]

Robbo - did you ever Speak to Barry Fuggle?
Back in the late 90's Barry was one of the directors of NPG, a conglomerate of sites as you know. I was running the Cambridge sites at the time and we would often get merchandise and incentives for the tournies that Barry was promoting - T-shirts, posters, baseball caps that kind of thing - it'd be passed out to the Marshals and they in turn, when dealing with the punters would evangelise the events.

I've not run a site for some time now, but do these promotions still exist? Is there still that pressure of incentive being pushed through the supply chain to the site owner/ operator?

It certainly did work at the time, one of the last events Rafe Farmer (who worked for Barry at the time) organised, talked us into was the European Indoor, where we put 3 teams (of punters) in when it first began. and the Euro indoor ran for what? 6 years? all of which attended by an incarnation of the teams we put in from the first one.....

In regards to pull through of punters to tourny players, what is left now apart form the sites to promot that transition? There is no Paintball on the shelves in WHS no more. There is less now than ever before for Joe public to even realise that touney ball exists, let alone the complexities and cost of playing it. So whats left, the web? How many people find there way here, given that a google search for paintball brings up a million sites for local places to play, but no where a mention of the progresion of paintball, for something outside of the woods for pages and pages. Robbo - what are the web stats saying? Are you seeing an increase, or decline in fresh hits to P8int, since PGI died?

The point I'm trying to make, that unless you get the punters at the point of interest, I.e. whilst thay are playing punterball, then your not going to grab them at all, apart from a very very small minority that get here by other means.

Leagues, super events/ whatever will only cater for the people already here, and that number must be reducing everyday. A symptom, not a cuase.

 

[L.i.P.S]

Right, here goes, two pennies worth.

We are now in the position of possibly having 2 tournament series running deliberately on the same dates. We are also hearing rumors of possibly another two coming along soon in the midlands, and of course stuck in the middle is Wendy and arguably the most popular event in the UK.

when the f@ck are the organizers going to realize that they are responsible for killing the game, no I do not play anymore but I have worked in this industry for 19 years and I am struggling to bite my lip ( no pun intended).

All we have is a lack of trust, backbiting, and malicious date setting to try and hack up the opposition. The solution seems to be fill up the calendar to try and block out every weekend to put them out of business…….what do when end up with???.....events with no facilities, broken promises and no prizes due to lack of funds year in year out.

Players are drifting away from tournament paintball because they are hacked off with the lies, bull5hite and politics that are running the game.

All we need is structure, lets say we had type A event, X-Ball and 5 man together on the same day at a central location. Type B - X-Ball only, and type C - 5 man only.
Depending on the event there should be a minimum amount of fields with proper barricades and netting to a specified height, toilets and marshals per field. All events should provide overhead cover to a minimum size or standard. Reasonable quality food available at reasonable prices. Minimum of H-Pac Standard Air with proper safety and tank checks.!!!!
A fair price on entry fees.

Once the criteria for an event is laid down then if an event organizer pipes up and advertises an event then they need to make sure that they understand their obligation to provide the facilities.

This way an event organizer will know in advance the minimum standard required before they even consider advertising a date. If they are not prepared to put the investment into the event or they do not have the facilities available then hopefully they won’t throw a pointless iron in the fire.

Chris and I are personally fed up with turning up at events where half the teams advertised actually turn up and the poor buggers who make the effort have to make do with one or two fields, no cover, one toilet and half the necessary marshals available because the organizer has done the sums and realized they might only break even if they lay on the full monty . It demoralizes the teams who make the effort and makes them want to go back into the woods. The facilities should be there regardless of who actually shows. There MUST be a constant or benchmark for event organizers to adhere to. It may take a couple of months but I think teams will learn which events they can rely on and get bang for their bucks.

Maybe ‘Baller could police the threads that advertised events. If there is no clear promise that the minimum requirements for facilities are met at the outset then the thread can be deleted and then hopefully everyone can choose from proper events run by the good guys and girls.

I think I may be mad, but get the basic's right the rest may yet follow.

 

[Echowitch]

Obviously I haven't run a tournament and don't know all the costs involved, but aren't the fact that they keep moving locations, or are at locations the organisers don't own a major drain on the resources ?? I.E. Site owners charging the organisers a lot ?? Having to move all the equipment, hire equipment in, etc ??

Wouldn't it make sense for the organisers to invest in a static site ?? Something they can improve upon, add to, that doesn't involve fresh costs all the time, but would minimise the costs as they location is the same everytime, and nothing needs to be hired ??

 

[Dusty]

But which location? There will always be a lot of moaning by the people who it is a little bit too far from.