Opinions 141 rules?

[tech]

rules

I have done my fair share of marshalling and i know how difficult it is but i think that the marshals have to be impartial to the outcome of the game, not be assosiated to any of the teams involved and implement the rules with comon sense.

I always believed the refs job was to imporm a player that he had been eliminated from the game and if he believed that a player had broken the rules of the tournamet was to asses a penalty acordingly.

I now believe that refs are there to impliment penilties rather than to marshal a game in the object of fair play.

The marshal now has a greater say in the outcome of the game than a cheat could in many occasions. a player now has to be more concerned about been eliminated by a marshal than by his opposition!! how can this be right.

The revised 1-4-1 rule in the millenium series was put in to cover all events and avoid arguments, if a player is playing on with a hit he should be penalised.
it has been taken to far, the pack should not be a 1-4-1, just an elimination.

i would strongly earge the millenium to alter this and allow the refs to use common sense and not encourage them to be so automaton.

 

[Bunkerkidz]

I have done my fair share of marshalling and i know how difficult it is but i think that the marshals have to be impartial to the outcome of the game, not be assosiated to any of the teams involved and implement the rules with comon sense.

I always believed the refs job was to imporm a player that he had been eliminated from the game and if he believed that a player had broken the rules of the tournamet was to asses a penalty acordingly.

I now believe that refs are there to impliment penilties rather than to marshal a game in the object of fair play.

The marshal now has a greater say in the outcome of the game than a cheat could in many occasions. a player now has to be more concerned about been eliminated by a marshal than by his opposition!! how can this be right.

The revised 1-4-1 rule in the millenium series was put in to cover all events and avoid arguments, if a player is playing on with a hit he should be penalised.
it has been taken to far, the pack should not be a 1-4-1, just an elimination.

i would strongly earge the millenium to alter this and allow the refs to use common sense and not encourage them to be so automaton.

I don't agree, the key to good marshalling is consistence.

That's a given, and the easiest way to achieve consistency is to make the rules as simple and straightforward as possible, leaving as little space for personal interpretation as possible.

With this rule, it becomes easier for all refs to determine wether or not a penalty is to be assessed.

I still think there should be somewhat of a time factor associated with the 1 for 1 rule, for instance: "If a player continues to play for more than one second, then a penalty should be assessed."

This is merely because sometimes it seems that some marshalls seem a little caught up in wanting to pull 1 for 1's more than they care for doing a fair and good job, and there are some situations when it does get a little ridiculous, for instance the episode Beaker described, or instances where I have seen players diving in and getting shot during their slide, and as soon as they get up, they're given a 1 for 1.

Now off course these may just be isolated incidents, but they do happen and it would be nice if they could be taken out of the equation somehow.

And also, I do not agree at all with the assessment of a 1 for 1 for not having your hand on your head all the way into the deadbox. At all.

Especially because it wasn't the most consistent call out there, some refs would enforce it, some wouldn't, some teams would get it, some wouldn't. If you know what I mean.

 

[Chicago]

First you say...

Ihe easiest way to achieve consistency is to make the rules as simple and straightforward as possible, leaving as little space for personal interpretation as possible.

Then you say:

"If a player continues to play for more than one second, then a penalty should be assessed."

So which is it? No interpretation or interpretation? Pick one.

Especially because it wasn't the most consistent call out there, some refs would enforce it, some wouldn't, some teams would get it, some wouldn't. If you know what I mean.

And that has NOTHING to do with the rules. When your problem is that sometimes judges enforce the rules, and sometimes they don't, it DOES NOT MATTER what the rules say. You can write whatever you want in the rulebook; it doesn't matter, because the judges aren't following the rule book in the first place.

Rules need to be written so the game is fair when the judges are good. No amount of rule writing is going to make the game fair if your judges are bad, and trying to dumb down your rules to make them 'work' with shoddy judges is just going to get you bad judges enforcing bad rules. Sometimes.

 

[Bngi]

The marshalling standard has gone up and has made a very positive impact on the game.

Gone up compared to what and when?

 

[BOOGIE]

Compared to what it used to be . When you went to a tourny if you were good freinds with the marshalls at the event you were almost garanteed a sunday finish. The reffing in the 90s had issues that you players these days dont even know about. The marshalling has improved 100 fold over the last 5 years.The sooner you players understand that a penalty in paintball is the same as a penalty in other sports and not a sacralidge against man the better off you will be.If you ever watch american football everytime a lineman holds thats a 2 min ,1-4-1, or 1 min depending on your format. As long as the penelty is assed there is no problem but if it is missed there is just like paintball.

 

[rental]

Some players should really take the rule book and read it before they comment on things. It is shocking how few players actually know the rules of the sport they play. They act on things they might have heard but not actually understand.

This isn’t a personal attack Oli, please don’t see this as such.

How many sports would require their participants to have to read the rule book every year? My best guess would be one, and that is the game in question.

One of the main requirements in the classification of a sport is a universal rule book. which in all sports remains constant, in some sports such rugby there are minor alterations to assure the safety of the participants but no other editions are made to the rule book.

In paintball, penalties are altered every year in some occasions as the year has progressed.

The rules need to be defined and written in blood as such with the only alterations involving format of the games. This would only increase the profile of the game as well as increase the rules awareness by all participants.

 

[Oli HPG]

This isn’t a personal attack Oli, please don’t see this as such.

How many sports would require their participants to have to read the rule book every year? My best guess would be one, and that is the game in question.

One of the main requirements in the classification of a sport is a universal rule book. which in all sports remains constant, in some sports such rugby there are minor alterations to assure the safety of the participants but no other editions are made to the rule book.

In paintball, penalties are altered every year in some occasions as the year has progressed.

The rules need to be defined and written in blood as such with the only alterations involving format of the games. This would only increase the profile of the game as well as increase the rules awareness by all participants.

Why would I see this as a personal attack, Luke?

I agree we needs a decent rule book!

 

[Chicago]

How many sports would require their participants to have to read the rule book every year? My best guess would be one, and that is the game in question.

One of the main requirements in the classification of a sport is a universal rule book. which in all sports remains constant, in some sports such rugby there are minor alterations to assure the safety of the participants but no other editions are made to the rule book.

In paintball, penalties are altered every year in some occasions as the year has progressed.

The rules need to be defined and written in blood as such with the only alterations involving format of the games. This would only increase the profile of the game as well as increase the rules awareness by all participants.

You just made all that up. Pro sports in the US, who each have their OWN rulebook that NOBODY else uses, change rules all the time. Same goes for College, which, as mentioned, uses different rules than the pros. Which use different rules than high schools do - and high schools have different rules depending on which state you are in!

It's not so much that you have to read the rules once a year, just that you have to read the rules at least once (most players don't do even that) and then read up on the changes.

And hell, even with changes, you don't really need to read the rules- all you have to do is call yourself out when you're hit, and ask for a paint check when you might be hit and can't figure out if you are on your own. It is THAT simple. Everything else the refs (or your coach/captain) can take care of for you. You don't need to know that the penalty for wiping is a 3-for-1 - you'll find out when the ref pulls three more of your guys. And you don't need to know that you'll get a one-for-one for playing on with a pack hit - you'll find out when the ref pulls your teammate. But, it is handy to know the rule if you are going to bitch about the rules on the internet.


The reffing is fine. The players suck.


Note: I may be a bit extra jaded right now after spending a week listening to players bitch about problems that are 100% their fault, by willful act or just total laziness.

 

[rental]

You just made all that up.

Please take this as a personal attack!

Shut up mate, if I made that up its amazing how Kids get through their A-levels then isn’t it. Please look up the Classification of a Sport, and get back to me.

Please Give examples. But while you do that, of which don’t get me wrong I am actually interested. Even in the states in such sports like American football there are minor alterations in the rule books between states and Levels as i explained in my last post. so I do not dismiss this.

But in American Football the rules still remain the same through out the sports, offside rules, penalties and the foundation rules of the game remain the same throughout the sport, and kids learn these foundation rules from the first time they play the full game. Of which i believe there is an age restriction on Kids playing the full game in the US as there is in the UK for Rugby.

 

[shamu]

Oh yay! the universal rulebook arguement again. It's been at least a month since I last saw this debated


Look, you're both right and you're both wrong. Let's take football as an example. The same basic rules apply across all levels of the sport - number of players, scoring, general game rules like 10 yards for a first down. Now, when you look at the exact wording of many rules you will notice differences. Simple things like when a pass is ruled complete differs from level (pro = both feet down, inbounds and control) to level (college = one foot down, inbounds, looser control requirements). Holding is different, as are the facemask and unsportsmanlike penalties.

By one way of looking at things, we already have a universal rulebook in that the sport is generally played with the same conventions across both Xball and 7man (startbox, two teams of players, safety rules, eliminations, no physcial contact, etc). You can also say we're nowhere close to a universal rulebook because of the differences (number of players, game length, scoring, etc). The point of this is that a "universal rulebook" depends on what you consider "universal".

Regardless of how you look at it, the universal rulebook isn't going to improve Millennium reffing, PSP reffing or NPPL reffing. You want better, more consistent reffing, here's what you need:
- start training the refs for more than one day
- get the same guys to come back event to event
- invest in an ongoing coaching and development plan for the referees
- last (and probably least) clean up the rulebooks.

It's not sexy. It's not complex. It just takes time, effort and some monetary investment. (insert pithy comment about tournament promoters here)