Is Reunification still in the cards?

[MissyQ]

Loco - Yes, I think as far as unification goes, I would say Pete is pretty right-on. There is more that could have been done on both sides, in order to nurse ego's and facilitate more dialogue, however, this is often the case in such things. Integration normally requires one party to be significantly stronger, or weaker, than the other. Until that happens integration may remain what both sides knows is for the best, but aren't prepared to make any sacrifices for.

Pete - I would argue that the NPPL had a TV deal, and there was real progress being made on the sponsors. Unfortunately when the TV deal went, the sponsors were not so interested in putting in the big bucks. So, personally I have seen a big move forward, followed by a big move backwards, and this is why I still blame Smart Parts. I really think this was a move that has a small positive side for SP, and a larger negative for the industry in General. It also had a major bearing on integration, at least thats what I believe.

 

[Robbo]

Pete - I would argue that the NPPL had a TV deal, and there was real progress being made on the sponsors. Unfortunately when the TV deal went, the sponsors were not so interested in putting in the big bucks. So, personally I have seen a big move forward, followed by a big move backwards, and this is why I still blame Smart Parts. I really think this was a move that has a small positive side for SP, and a larger negative for the industry in General. It also had a major bearing on integration, at least thats what I believe.

Well, I don't think you had a deal in the bag mate in that the original deal was an outside commissioning to IMG anyway that may or may not have been taken up again.
Although conjecture, it is reasonable to assume I think that the SP (paying) deal with ESPN would have undermined any re-commissioning but as I see it, I think the IMG / NPPL production was of such quality that when compared to anything Braun had his fingers involved in, ESPN should have still wanted to go ahead with any re-commissioning but once again, this is speculation.

Although integration and prospective TV deals affect each other, it is not fair to link them in the way you do because the NPPL could have easily severed the link between the PSP guys and Gardners / Braun but you chose not to, and you know as well as I do mate, the time was ripe because of how the remainder members of the PSP viewed what the Gardner / Braun contingent had gotten up to with their own TV deal.

I think if the NPPL had taken that opportunity to integrate, then any TV deal would have maybe fallen into place for you or the PSP / NPPL combine could have maybe done a commissioning of your own with IMG but now????... what have the NPPL got now in terms of strategic advantage???

 

[MissyQ]

I would say that the NPPL has an advantage in the product it offers, others may not agree, but I think the style and scale of events the NPPL has been putting on this year have been the best yet. I have not seen SP's event, I only know that they have apparently chosen to blow another load of money producing a 2nd one. I don't really get where the PSP and SP are at the moment. So if the PSP owners get on board with SP, does that become part of the PSP roadshow? Do those teams now have to play SP events AND PSP events now? If they are all in it together, then why don't they combine the events? Can someone explain how all that works? At the moment, it looks like its the SPL and the PSP that have to 'integrate', unless sponsors are again being asked to double (triple) up...

 

[MissyQ]

it is reasonable to assume I think that the SP (paying) deal with ESPN would have undermined any re-commissioning

The basis of my post. This is indeed what happened, and why I continue to blame them.

 

[Robbo]

I would say that the NPPL has an advantage in the product it offers, others may not agree, but I think the style and scale of events the NPPL has been putting on this year have been the best yet. I have not seen SP's event, I only know that they have apparently chosen to blow another load of money producing a 2nd one. I don't really get where the PSP and SP are at the moment. So if the PSP owners get on board with SP, does that become part of the PSP roadshow? Do those teams now have to play SP events AND PSP events now? If they are all in it together, then why don't they combine the events? Can someone explain how all that works? At the moment, it looks like its the SPL and the PSP that have to 'integrate', unless sponsors are again being asked to double (triple) up...

The 'product' is easily manipulated no matter who gets the TV deal Missy as you well know so in a sense, this point is academic.
As for scale and style of events, you guys win hands down, no argument from me or from any sane person I would think on that score.
As for the dilemmas caused over in the PSP / SPL camp, these are acaedmic to what we are talking about because this could have all been averted if you guys had integrated when you had the chance.

As for how they all integrate the PSP with the SPL, gawd knows and I don't really care, all I know is, it didn't have to go the way it did, it really didn't.

 

[Robbo]

The basis of my post. This is indeed what happened, and why I continue to blame them.

I never said they weren't to blame in some way, I am just suggesting there are other, just as important factors that need to be considered when looking at the failure of the integration talks.

 

[Baca Loco]

I would say that the NPPL has an advantage in the product it offers, others may not agree, but I think the style and scale of events the NPPL has been putting on this year have been the best yet. I have not seen SP's event, I only know that they have apparently chosen to blow another load of money producing a 2nd one. I don't really get where the PSP and SP are at the moment. So if the PSP owners get on board with SP, does that become part of the PSP roadshow? Do those teams now have to play SP events AND PSP events now? If they are all in it together, then why don't they combine the events? Can someone explain how all that works? At the moment, it looks like its the SPL and the PSP that have to 'integrate', unless sponsors are again being asked to double (triple) up...

All good questions as the continuing ambiguity does tend to project a possibly debased NXL future or a future that has a radically reorganized NXL---assuming the NXL name even continues. Then again, as long as the key players are offered reasonable participation options, there's no real reason the PSP & SPL couldn't run on parallel tracks for awhile if a discernable measure of TV success is apparent.

As to your 'product' opinion I have to raise the same distinction (or at least a similar one to the one Pete raised) between the game played and the presentation of the game. I will readily grant that PP does a great job putting on an event but I'm not convinced that's the product or the correct product to be touting, at any rate.

Since it isn't my money I remain in favor of both. As unrealistic as that may be. Still, look at the UFC and Pride. Both are succeeeding and beginning to do so at a level that is spawning not less but even more competition as lesser leagues are appearing along with rumored competition for the "championship" level of the market and sport. There is little doubt that there are more paintball players than there are peeps who enjoy beating and being beaten to bloody pulps for fun and profit.

 

[Chicago]

One of the things holding paintball back from television right now is the 'involved parties' can't decide what they want to be. Do they want to be membership organizations that charge every person who walks onto a tournament field money? Or do they want to be a marketing organization that charges out-side industry sponsors for access to paintball fans?

You can't really be both, not at the start anyway. And the attempts to be both are preventing people from being either. Well, I should say are preventing NPPL from being either, PSP has gotten their stuff together so recently that their failures to date are based more in the basic incompetence realm.

Speaking of, Pete, PSP events are better run than NPPL events. That wasn't true last year. It ceretainly wasn't true at Texas. And it wasn't more than a fluke after that. But PSP has figured out how to consistently run good events, and consistently provide basic, quality services that NPPL is simply not providing. Texas was like Tiger Woods reworking his swing - it sucked, but now that it's all been worked out things are rocking and rolling. Of course, I have no doubt that PSP will find a way to screw that all up if not by the end of this year, by the start of next. But right now, if anyone thinks NPPL is running better tournaments than PSP has been, it's because they havn't been to a PSP event since Texas.

Either way, the NXL is dead. PSP is going to run Pro PSP next year. Other people may or may not do their own things. Smart Parts can create one-off shows until they are blue in the face, it's not going to get them anywhere. Maybe they'll get lucky and get a season or two. But it's not going to stick - it'll be the same as Dodgeball. The novelty of that movie was enough of an excuse for 'the sport' (and by 'the sport', I mean the one actual league that happened to play in the LA area) to get on the air for three seasons, but then they were gone, and they're gone permanently. They never developed the basic core fan base to be a marketable sport. I actually know a guy who played 'Pro' dodgeball. They all thought the TV show was a joke, but you got $5k for winning, which isn't a bad deal for a buncha havn't-quite-made-it's and reality-show-rejects in LA.


Paintball has good numbers. Actually, that's not true. Paintball has EXTRAORDINARY numbers. But the industry seems bent on preventing those numbers from being used in a coordinated, overwhelming manner. Smart Parts is part of the problem - but NPPL is just as much part of the problem. And I just don't see how you can blame Smart Parts for doing their own TV show when that's EXACTLY what NPPL has been trying to do since 2003! You could have unified. You could have made it so everyone in the industry (except smart parts) was on the same page. You have the power! But you don't want to give up having YOUR show on TV either. So we continue with the same old ****...

 

[Robbo]

Knee-jerk attacks on Smart Parts isn't the answer, in fact it's detrimental to what needs to be done because all it does is default into the same ole behaviour patterns that got us all in this fackin mess in the first place.
It seems we never learn from our mistakes which in my book smacks of bigotry and ignorance and doesn't bode too well for the short to mid term futures.
Too much animosity has passed people's way which leaves people predisposed to ridiculous decision making whereby the real issues of determining best solutions are ignored in favour of satisfying unprofessional and wholly inappropriate agendas.
I am sure a lot of these people might say I am mistaken or talking out me ass
but I'm afraid if it isn't what I suggested, then what the fuk else explains the direction we have come in?
There is no way in this world the decisions that have been made re integration have been due to a reasoned approach, it is self-evident they haven't and the only other possible explanation is these people are stupid.
Now whilst they may do stupid things, they aren't stupid people, there is a profound difference.

As for the PSP catching up, I think it's got a long way to go in terms of atmosphere and promotion.
Certainly the logistics is on a par but one of the things that sets the NPPL apart is their attention to detail in terms of promotion.
Those guys really do know how to promote an event but that degree of attention can only be sustained if the income streams remain intact and at the moment, that is coming under increasing pressure due to a contracted vendor base with still no sight of a white knight outside sponsor or any TV deal.

 

[Chicago]

NPPL does have better atmosphere, but at what point is logistics more important than atmosphere?