Should British Army upgrade?

[Tom]

it annoys me when i see americans with m4's and m16 they are much better and reliable weapons.

Not exactly true - and is currently a political sore point in the US

If we want reliable weapons we should be using the ak47

 

[MitchMan]

The SA80 is almost too much of a precision rifle - the AK47 for instance is not engineered well with poor tolerances, but it is because of this it is reliable.

MitchMan

 

[Tom]

The SA80 is almost too much of a precision rifle - the AK47 for instance is not engineered well with poor tolerances, but it is because of this it is reliable.

MitchMan

The sa80 and the ak47 are two different guns for different purposes
Sa80 is for a trained disciplined army with logistics.
Ak47 is for extreme conditions (Russian equipment has a long tradition of being roughly made and hard wearing. Not only the ak47, but definately tanks)
The ak47 needs to function in all conditions, wide tolerances lose precision but gain the ability to survive abuse.
The sten is more comparative to the ak47
(But it's an smg not an assault rifle)

 

[MitchMan]

Very true, but the SA80 was designed by the Enfield factory at a time when we thought we would be fighting on the Northern plains of Europe, and also Northern Ireland - not much heat, or dry sand in those places....

However it was then asked to function well in Iraq and Afghanistan - conditions that it was never really tested against - and so a less precise/more reliable (in those conditions) type tactical assault rifle might now be called for.

MitchMan

 

[slam]

Sorry but that isn't the case, the A1 suffered in the dry dusty conditions but the A2 has solved all the stoppage problems that the A1was so prone to. The Ak is inherently inaccurate and therefore wouldn't be able to follow the Army doctrine, it is a spray and pray weapon rather than the A2 precise aimed shot approach. Also the Ak was designed to carry on working even when being operated and maitained by people not properly train on the weapon system, something the British Army would never suffer from

 

[Tom]

Very true, but the SA80 was designed by the Enfield factory at a time when we thought we would be fighting on the Northern plains of Europe, and also Northern Ireland - not much heat, or dry sand in those places....

However it was then asked to function well in Iraq and Afghanistan - conditions that it was never really tested against - and so a less precise/more reliable (in those conditions) type tactical assault rifle might now be called for.

MitchMan

As Mitch has said the SA80 was modified and improved over the years, including making it suitable for dirty conditions.
You don't have to have tolerences to work in harsh environments.
The M16 which was the original weapon to be put to scrutiny against the AK47 was advertised as working with no maintenance (meaning low maintenance but then hyped up)
The average conscript believed it. However put it in a harsh jungle environment, and rip off at full auto into the bush, without basic maintenace and it will fail.

 

[Missy-Q]

I just bought a Lee Enfield Mk1 #3, sporterised by Parker Hale of Birmingham England.

I love it. We should have stayed with those. I can choose which eye to shoot out at 200yds.

 

[Tom]

I just bought a Lee Enfield Mk1 #3, sporterised by Parker Hale of Birmingham England.

I love it. We should have stayed with those. I can choose which eye to shoot out at 200yds.

It all went downhill after the brown bess

 

[gommie404]

oh my is this thread still going,,, right upgrades,,,what ever is laying on the floor when your out of ammo,,
and the main problem with all guns in the dust is oil and greese,, and it still freaks me right out to find out that serving chaps are still not lubing there guns with pencil lead,,,back in the day you would rub pencil lead on some find sand paper then blow that onto your moving parts,,,boosh super lube thats not a dirt magnet as nothing sticks to it..
and today that product can be found in spray form at locksmith shops,,,

it dont matter what weapon you have, you have to change your lube to suit,,
Down side. lead makes every thing black and with get on your hands and on your face ect ect...
but who gives a **** my gun works when i want it to,,,not when it wants to,,

by the way,,, this kind of lube is allso fantasic on dirt bikes..as you dont get all the crap sticking to your chain and sprockets.. perfect..oh yes...

so..get your lead out... now you know where the saying comes from..

 

[Jay Wilko]

300million ain't really a lot to say we are giving billions per year to over seas aid, cut it down by half for a year and chuck our boys and girls some new toys