Gypsies and paintball

[sundance1968]

filming this programme is an eye opener for most of us

as long as our comments are not blatant attacks or hated filled i feel its within reason for a discussion about this series

one thing that really astonished me watching the programme was when the group of lads were driving in a 4x4 and came accross an accident with a pedestrian and the driver simply broke every law of the road mounting the pavements to make his way around the scene

now had that been an accident involving gypsy vehicles and people would he have still drove that way ?

 

[Rat]

like you sundance i was shocked at his mannerisms to the accident, and his sheer impatientness.

however watching the series from start to finish i have to say i admire some of their traditions and attributes that i think modern society are missing.

 

[CraigofScotland]

While we cant say all travellers have a low IQ and common sense of frog, the people we have been shown in the programme have, to say the least, been rather stupid. Its not racist when against the indiduals?

On the flip side, I never realised they were so stringent on sex. It does explain why they are all getting married at 16. They are horny.

 

[Soul Doubt]

This does provoke a reasonable but potentially inflammatory question of cultural differences in terms of behaviour ... if we can identify and attribute definite behavioural differences to certain races, is it then racist to articulate those differences?

I dont think its a racial trait, there are many many people who act in a similar manner to these people, who have never had exposure to this culture. My answer? a social construct, we created these people, the same that every avenue of society has been created by us. the influences that these people have been exposed to since dot, have created what we see. Its consumerism and anti-consumerism blended into gypsy community (the fairytale weddings and yet the distance from "normal society) it almost felt medievil watching that programme.

It has always puzzled me, as to why people behave this way, especially in the context of conduct at a piantball site. it seems their counter-culture to the norm in there eyes is the right way to be. BUT what gets me, is when they see others at the paintball site or wider society, do they not look at those people and think "why dont i act like these people?" their perception of themselves must not register the factors of 'right & wrong' but whats best for me as they see it. puzzling.

 

[Missy-Q]

I guess it depends on whether you see Gypsies as a 'Race' of people. These aren't 'Romany' Gypsies. These are, for want of a better word, 'outlaws', as in, they live outside of the laws of the realm.
People often feel that Gypsies are in some way 'unfortunate' and should be helped. This is so far from the truth. They choose their way of life and have no wish to change it, either by their own hard-work or through the charity of others. They are how they want to be.
We used to have Gypsies set up next to our factory twice per year. We would catch the kids in our warehouse, and when we did, they were like wild animals (I'm talking 12 year old kids, biting and snarling), they would throw dead cats and dogs, plus their filth, onto our cars. Even the local gangs would disappear.
In Walsall, there was a drive to provide housing for hundreds of Gypsies. The estate they put them on is now completely trashed, and social services have had to be brought in due to the amount of interbreeding going on. They are running amok. It's now the most dangerous estate in the Midlands.

By hating on Gypsies though, who are we discriminating against? Organised crime? The uneducated? People with crazy accents? The jails are full of similar people. Can you be considered racist for not liking, or actively avoiding and speaking out against a criminal element? We are lucky enough to live in a society where education is free, crimes are generally punished, welfare is provided, and we all pay a ****-load of taxes to facilitate this (oh, except for the Gypsies). Their crimes most often go unpunished, they can't be processed, as they have no fixed abode. They choose not to educate their kids, or in fact their adults, break the law at will, with no consideration to the consequences to themselves or to others, and we should feel like we're being 'racist' because we speak out against it? Why?

If they lived in peace, and didn't bother the residents of the places they passed through, would they have the reputation they have? Of course not. They never fail to live up to their rep. hence, they earned it, and if I want to call them a bunch of theiving scumbags, they earned that too, and there's no way this sister is gonna feel racist about that!

besides - anyone ever heard of a black Gypsy?
Now who's racist?

 

[Robbo]

like you sundance i was shocked at his mannerisms to the accident, and his sheer impatientness.

however watching the series from start to finish i have to say i admire some of their traditions and attributes that i think modern society are missing.

Hey Rat, I think you can maybe say the same thing about Hitler in that some of his successes in terms of the German economy were also admirable, there's that and his strength of mind and a whole raft of attributes that were I suppose positive but the bottom line is this, would you want gypsies living next door to you???

Personally, I wouldn't ..... and I speak from experience not prejudice.

 

[foster90]

Well said Missy and I agree completely *Applause*

 

[Robbo]

I dont think its a racial trait, there are many many people who act in a similar manner to these people, who have never had exposure to this culture. My answer? a social construct, we created these people, the same that every avenue of society has been created by us. the influences that these people have been exposed to since dot, have created what we see. Its consumerism and anti-consumerism blended into gypsy community (the fairytale weddings and yet the distance from "normal society) it almost felt medievil watching that programme.

Firstly, it can be defined as a cultural / racial trait if a significant number of that demographic behave in a certain way; as to where you draw the line in terms of significance, I'm pretty sure some social scientist can indicate what that is but from my experience, a significant number exhibit outlaw type thinking.
Soul Doubt, if you are suggesting the behaviors of the gypsies are a social construct then I believe, you are totally, utterly and unbelievably wrong ...... these people elect to leave school and therefore not educate themselves, the state provides them with an opportunity and they ignore it ... all they gotta do is go to school and get educated.

...Now, it's because they do not get educated they are then restricted in what they can do to earn money; not many employers are too keen to take people on who can't even read or write properly.
And so, far from their position being a social construct, it is in fact a cultural deconstruct in that they choose not to become educated .. they deconstructed the opportunity, and society did NOT provide a construct to help create their behaviour profiles.

I'm not really sure what the latter part of this paragraph means, sorry.

 

[Orion3]

Gypsies....hmm.

Once upon a time my attitude was one of indiffernce - live and let live. I had little to no contact with them and didn't believe or dis-believe anything bothered reading about them.

Then one day, 50 or so of them turned up in a field behind my house.

The horses that lived there were terrified and chased, the field was turned into a sh** hole in under a day. Crap from f**k knows where materialised and was dumped, grass was burnt, the tree line at the end of my garded was turned into a toilet. Not much surprises me but this....I was shocked. I didn't leave the house unattended until they were finally evicted and mine was the only house that didn't have anything stolen or dumped in/on.

Honest opinion - I'm sure that some of them, somewhere are decent human beings...just I've never met or seen them. Mr Hankey, the Christmas poo, rates higher on my social scale of acceptance.

They want to play paintball with no masks - let them - it's their own choice! Maybe then they can learn to live with the consequences of their actions rather that everyone else, live with the consequences of their actions.

Rant over!

 

[Missy-Q]

Gypsies....hmm.

Once upon a time my attitude was one of indiffernce - live and let live. I had little to no contact with them and didn't believe or dis-believe anything bothered reading about them.

Then one day, 50 or so of them turned up in a field behind my house.

The horses that lived there were terrified and chased, the field was turned into a sh** hole in under a day. Crap from f**k knows where materialised and was dumped, grass was burnt, the tree line at the end of my garded was turned into a toilet. Not much surprises me but this....I was shocked. I didn't leave the house unattended until they were finally evicted and mine was the only house that didn't have anything stolen or dumped in/on.

Honest opinion - I'm sure that some of them, somewhere are decent human beings...just I've never met or seen them. Mr Hankey, the Christmas poo, rates higher on my social scale of acceptance.

They want to play paintball with no masks - let them - it's their own choice! Maybe then they can learn to live with the consequences of their actions rather that everyone else, live with the consequences of their actions.

Rant over!

This is going to be a common theme. Is there anyone that HAS had personal experience with Gypsies that does NOT think they are basically a gang of thieves moving from place to place, stealing all our stuff, with no regard for the law?

I mean, the Somalians do it, and everyone things it's 'unbelievable'. "Piracy, in this day and age!!" Well, someone want to tell me what the difference is? In fact, the Gypsies are worse. The Somalians live in a lawless state. They have no police, no government, no laws. They actually have an excuse for going out and robbing people...