Orracle Cocker all limp...well nearly....any clever chaps out there?...

[Tenebrae]

Alreet chaps, I bought meself an Orracle cocker some years ago, fettled it...left it.. the poor little fella has sat in a box for many moons...anyhow..plonker here took it to the formula 5 at the weekend, stuck gas in it and nowt happened...(now the embarassing bit) I forgot to turn the on/off gas switch to on...only realised that when I got home..(stop laughing)

Anyhow..prior to my descovery (you think I would know better after years on the ball so to speak) I'd felched and farted about with the main reg, the LPR and I believe at somepoint I've even removed the back block...

I digress..

I stuck some gas up its rear and off it went, pull the trigger..goooooood...pull it again...gooooder..and then it sometimes has a automatic session firing on its todd..

Now.. slowly getting me head around it (and I've run out of gas so I can't check)
could this be caused by the back cocking block preventing the bolt from latching on the sear? as upon examination there is what appears to be a 1mm ish gap when closed between the block and the rear of the body..just wondering if there is a length of travel specified for the ram and cocking arm at all...?

I imagine there is a zillion other things it could be but since it is a tad less complicated for me to work out than its fully mechanical fore father, and is practically new (but old) I feel most strongly that it's my fettling prior to my descovery that has left me cocker all limp..

There must be some mighty brained cocker lovers out there!!

Thanks for anyhelp..(ps..anyone got a nice supply of gas I can use ..?..only way to learn is to do...and I can't do without the magic gas man!! lol)

 

[phil-boy]

Theres a couple of good cocker techey people on here, GeeTee is one and the other being wihglah (think thats his user name)

Other than that you could try Nicky T at Planet.

Hope you manage to get it sorted out.

 

[Tenebrae]

Cheers Phil, I shall look further !! Hopefully I'll drag a working Orracle to the next Formula 5..! lol... Although storm might thrown upon my use of such a pretty thing alongside them..lol.. them with all their invert mini things.. show them up I will..!

 

[k4p84]

I'm a bit rusty on Cocker tech but how about:

Back block along with the cocking rod cocks the hammer on the sear. If you have not threaded the cocking rod and back block back to their original positions you could get cocking issues if it was very finely tuned.
Easy to test, if you pull the back block back does it c0ck the hammer on the sear then travel a bit further? If so not an issue.

The sear needs adjusting. If the hammer is not always being retained you need to drop an allen (sorry unsure of size) down through the body from the top. There will be a hole about half way down the top chamber. 1/4 turns was the usual adjustment if I remember.
I think the hammer tripping of the sear only occured for me when I went from mech to electro on my Eclipse Factory cocker.

LPR, this is the pressure used to push the back block back to c0ck the marker. If there is not enough pressure the ram does not have enough umph to get over the spring tension. I never played with this but if the ram can push the back block back to c0ck the marker this should be ok. I can remember a test was to pull the back block while the marker was gassed up but this was usually done by a chap more learned who could feel if it was over pressured, etc.

HPR, the old sweet spotting the reg part here. If you have a reg tester set the reg to the correct input pressure (check the manuals for a rough pressure guide)

If all else fails give it one tap on the right of the body, two on the right. If that does not solve it get a beer out the fridge and relax safe in the knowledge you tried your best

Regards

Ed

 

[Tenebrae]

Chuckle.. cheers!
From what I can gather one thinks I need to first establish if indeed my oracle has been tweaked beyond factory settings as well...blimey tis a mine field in there! lol..

Does appear that my cocker is cocking ok...plus I should have a dinky gap and it does as you mentioned..just seems to be a bit overly 'bouncy'...in a silly way..mind you handy if I want a full auto..

Intriguing things these cockers once you get started... (just wish I had a flipping 3000 psi refill station in my garage!)

 

[Gee Tee]

Is the cocker Eblade or mech, and if electro which model? You should have a small gap (0.5-1.0mm) between back block and body, otherwise you can strip threads out of block or snap the cocking arm.

If you c0ck the gun manually (ungassed) the sear should catch just as bolt clears feed elbow. If it's catching to early/late you can adjust this with cocking bar. Sear should release about 1/2 way through pan solenoid travel on eblades. You can check manually with a screwdriver, through frame with grips off - degassed and switched off. Sear is adjusted with 1/8 allen key through top of body once bolt is pulled out. Make sure battery is good (especially on E1's) otherwise gun won't shoot properly.

LP setting depends on type of reg used, and spec of ram etc. Rule of thumb is to increase pressure until it c0cks reliably, then add another 1/8 - 1/4 turn and leave it there.

Inline reg sweetspotting and other set-up articles covered here

http://customcockers.com/forum/showthread.php?11597-[MPP-Article]-How-to-set-an-inline-regulator

http://customcockers.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?17-Autococker-Articles

 

[Bolter]

I dont know anything about fixing cockers, but you have got an eblade frame on it have you not?

Also 2nd thing I thought of was maybe if you had a very small amount in your bottle, it wasnt taking a full shot of air and not cocking quite correctly and therefore getting the full auto thing?

Maybe?

Lastly, and you'll like this one, I have a full bottle of air. Come get it if you want it

oh yea, also also final thing http://www.mcarterbrown.com/ is pretty good with these things, but I noticed GeeTee has posted. You're in good hands mate.

 

[Thib]

I can sort this for you if you want.

 

[WihGlah]

Lets see a picture so we know what we are talking about.

The travel of the back block should be determined by the stroke of the ram - which should be unhindered by other effects.

A 1mm back block gap seems a touch high - but shouldn't cause a problem.

Sounds like you've might have good old fashioned trigger bounce.

Lengthening the trigger pull should fix it.

 

[Tenebrae]

Cheers Chaps...some good clever old chaps on here for sure...!!

After arriving home this arvo I cracked open my 'marker tech box' lol...fettled out the necessary allens and opened up the old Orracle.. (yep..its an electronic worr games orracle ..purdy metallic blue, nice little pics can be found in google) anyhow..

reset to factory setting slow..

eye off..

cocked.. trigger pull...fine..returns and recocks (by hand at this stage) as described by a few above with the little extra touch at the end..back block gap 1.4mm, a further turn in takes it to 0.46 mm ish which is a tad too close for my liking.

so I sat wondering why the chuff is it sending the bolt forward...and as I merrily pumped the trigger..every now and then nowt happened.. no happy little click from the sear solenoid.. sometimes it comes on..sometimes not...

a blimmin sticking sear solenoid!!! ahhaaaaaa...!!!! that explains the full auto..!

A tiny bit of lube, some tweaking and it seems to move most merrily, although I intend to strip it out and see what was stopping it..maybe just a tad dry after a couple of years in a box.

So far as it goes thats stage one..! Need some gas and a tub of paint and see what happens..got a feeling with a few minor lpr tweaks etc all should be singing merrily..

Failing that I'll happily take up the offers of assistance found on this thread!

Thanks Guys the paintball crowd really are a chuffin great bunch of peeps !

Rick

adam...i'll be hunting that bottle down soon me thinks!