larger HPA or scuba tank?

[big JME]

Hi everyone,

so my local field often doesnt have enough air at 3000psi to fill my tank past maybe 2000psi. As i only have a small 0.8L tank which can handle around 600 shots from my current marker but i will soon be upgrading to a much more efficient etek4 from my bt omega. But since i want a upgrade to play more often i am stuck in a predicament. My paintball site doesnt fill 4500psi tanks which i was going to buy. i found a larger 1.5L 4500psi for £210 which is the lightest and largest capacity i could find. It should hold around 1800 shots and more then that with my new marker. but i have to go to a local dive shop to have it filled.

for slightly more i have been looking at a 12L 4500psi Scuba tank which already has a gun charge kit on it for air guns and its priced at £229 and fills are around £5 which is nothing. Since i've never used a scuba tank before especially not to fill a lower pressure tank i was wondering if anyone could help me decide. I have the choice between;

1. a large HPA tank able to run me through a days paintball that i will need to have filled every day before going at a cost of around £2
2. a large scuba tank with fill kit able to fill my small tank many times without pressure drops (filling 3000psi from a 4500psi tank)

the tank i have been looking at is this one; tank

any advice from anyone who has experience in using this sort of setup would be great as i know filling the 3000psi from the 4500psi is very risky and will have to be done very slowly. and any advice on whoch you all think would be more worth while would be great. I know currently the scuba tank seems the best option but may not be due to cons i may not yet have thought of and also if anyone knows how the air gun charge kit actually works when connecting to a HPA tank (if it needs adaptors etc.)

Regards,
Jamie

 

[Tom]

For your circumstances a scuba cylinder and fill rig will be the better solution.

As you say a fill from a dive shop will have a basic price no matter what size the fill so a scuba bottle will work out cheap per fill.

I'm not sure on the air gun fittings they will supply.
If you were to just get a scuba cylinder then you would need a fillrig adaptor with either DIN or A clamp fittings. e.g.:
http://www.rap4uk.com/Scuba-Refill-Station-p/1215.htm
http://www.rap4uk.com/Scuba-Fill-Station-p/v-sfs.htm
http://www.rap4uk.com/HP-Fill-station-p/v-hpfs.htm

The RAP4 scuba cylinder is less attractive as it is 3000psi max, the LIPS one is ready for paintball fills with 4500psi max and the fill rig ready.
But depending on the adaptor the one you have above looks to be the cheapest option.

If you had a regulated fill rig down to 3000psi then filling becomes simple. Without a regulated fill rig then it is more risky to fill 3000psi from 4500psi, but it can be done safely with care. (If you make a mistake then all you get is a blown safety disk and possibly brown trousers)

No matter what pressure is involved always fill slowly.
Assuming the fill rig is assembled, fit the cylinder to the rig.
Idealy hold it in a position that it is not pointing at you
Try to get a position that you can see all pressure gauges
Slowly open the scuba fill valve.
Watch all gauges if possible, watch the paintball cylinder guage if you can only see one
Start to close the scuba fill valve before it gets up to pressure
Fully close it when at the pressure you need.

There will be a purge/bleed valve button on the rig.
Press/unscrew the purge/bleed as applicable to release the pressure in the rig
Disconnect the cylinder
Cover up all fittings with caps etc

If you maintain a pressure in the source then you will get consistent fills, and when you return to the dive shop it takes less air to fill
Note when filling and the cylinder gets hot the pressure will drop slightly afterwards as it cools
If you get 4500psi on the scubas first fill it will get hot and you will lose pressure, unless they top up after it cools

 

[big JME]

that was the idea of using the 4500psi tank, although i wont have the full 4500psi fill, and after every fill on my 3000psi tank the pressure will drop, i will get a heck of a lot of fills before the pressure drops to even 3000psi so should be sorted. i have spare burst disks (5k) so if anything happens i can replace them.

What you posted has been a great help, i've seen the lips and rap4 ones, the rap4 i would rather avoid and get the 300bar. the lips one is rather a lot more. The one im looking at has the normal open-close valve, and a pressure valve, it also has a hose which is something a lot of people say they dont like with other fill rigs because of having to hold it. Since the place selling the cylinder i want are close to me i can check it and talk to them i just want to know what people think would be better in my situation.

i havent yet upgraded my marker so i can either use my current marker, buy the scuba tank and try it. or ask the site to fill the dive tank for me personally to ensure i have enough pressure, buy my new marker and just use what i can untill i can afford the dive tank. As im only getting ~550 shots now, once i get my new marker it operates using an in-line reg which drops it to very low pressure so should get many more shots out of it.

 

[frenchy2475]

If you decide to go with the divers tank with the hose you will need a female fill adaptor.
http://www.lips-paintball.com/acatalog/Air_Fittings_and_Hoses.html 6 item down the page.
I used to fill my tank this way before I got a proper fill rig. It will do you fine until you decide to get one.

 

[big JME]

That is the one i was looking at. So you'd recommend to buy a proper rig instead of one like i have been looking at?

 

[Gee Tee]

My Dive bottle was bought second hand (£50) and got it retested by my local dive shop. It's a Faber 232Bar 15L tank and gives me lots of fills or top-ups to 3000psi. I don't really use it for games now as all the sites I use provide free air fills, but it's dead handy for building and testing markers at home. Make sure you buy the right fill rig for any tank you buy. There are two types Din or A Clamp fitting to bottle valve. My dive shop charges £4 to fill a bottle and just under £40 for a re-test. They also fill 232 and 300 bar tanks in a water bath to keep them cool and ensure a full capacity fill. Fitting a 'surface only' valve to tanks is also a good idea. The testing is cheaper and needed less often than submerged diving bottles. 300bar tanks are also available 2nd hand but tend to be more expensive and smaller capacity - 12L or less

 

[big JME]

Thanks, a lot of the tanks ive found (only checked ebay) are coming up expensive compared to what you paid

 

[Gee Tee]

There are new cylinders here for £99 + P&P, which sounds like a great deal

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Scuba-Diving-CYLINDER-PACKAGE-Comprising-Dive-Tank-Dive-Valve-Boot-3L-to-15L-/330614741540?pt=UK_SportingGoods_Scuba_SnorkellingEquipment_SM&var=&hash=item4cfa2c9a24

I paid £80 for mine including the re-test.

 

[big JME]

Yeh they do look good but when you select 12l for a decent size it soon shoots up to £240, and unless i buy new i have to go collect the tank and they all seem a very long way away

 

[Gee Tee]

There's also this 15L Faber up for bids, although collection is from Suffolk

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/dive-bottle-air-rifle-/120928645046?pt=UK_SportingGoods_Hunting_ShootingSports_ET&hash=item1c27e8afb6

and others here..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300-Bar-12Lt-Faber-Dive-Cylinder-/130706700152?_trksid=p4340.m1374&_trkparms=algo=PI.WATCH&its=C%2BS&itu=UCC&otn=15&ps=63&c

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/15Ltr-Faber-Dive-Tank-/270991298578?pt=UK_SportingGoods_Scuba_SnorkellingEquipment_SM&hash=item3f18571012lkid=8978242274004347198

You often find dive tanks are sold for collection only due to cost of shipping. I picked up mine from Grays in Essex.