Opus Finale .... A Warts an' all Exposé of Paintball's Very Own Megalomaniac

[Spikerz]

I give him a thumbs up solely on the basis of being a paintballer at 62. Also if my LinkedIn stalking is good enough, he's quite good at being a business coach and dealing with water systems.

Perhaps 800 Sterling isn't a lot, I won't argue if it is or not. But surely the 61,000+ that is left outstanding would be, although if that gets buried under the auspices of a failed company, there may be no legal methods to pursue and if there are, I doubt we'd be privy to them until such time as they hit the public domain via normal judicial channels.

At times our lengthy cautionary tale may have tangentially swung between multiple subjects, but the foundational bits are clear. Someone who claims to have the best interests of the players in mind, flat out lied. Then that company made business decisions that it couldn't back up, and other companies suffered gravely. The only way to stop someone abusing the players of our sport and those who help support it, is to no longer play in those events or do business with those entities.

When the cash dries up, it'll be a death knell for all involved.

 

[Robbo]

Looks like 300,000 is but a tick away ... amazing, don't ya think @Dave284?

 

[H]

Well .... as I am going to say something about these postings I might as well introduce my self properly. My name is Jan van Hooff and I am not a UK resident. My interest in the UK paintball scene is, as a non sponsored paintball client with not a shred of affiliation to any paintball firm whatsoever, because in the UK, you people organise some very exciting games in venues that are not accessible in my country (the Netherlands, yes I am a Dutchie) or don't exist there. The non sponsered status resulted from a conscious choice as a have done so much "answering to people" in my lifetime, that I don't fancy it within the realm of my hobby/sport and I can afford that poshy attitude. Also I am a bit (lot) older than the average paintballer and in daily life I am a Chairman of the Board of a middle sized company. Without wanting to be posh I throw in my full seniority for the sake of my arguments. I hold the opinion, being a very "outside" man that I can make some observations which can't be made anymore by the participants of this thread. I hope to give you some insight on the effects of your writings.

.I know Shoreline as a company because they first raised my interest in the UK scenario scene and I have played some of their events. Also quite recently because I attended the Afghan game only a fortnight ago and as such I have met mr. and mrs. Barnett and I think it's fair to say that we are acquainted now.

The points I want to make out to you are the following:
1) Nobody, not the serious businessman, is happy with what is happening in this blog/thread. It is bad for business and keeps away potential clients who don't want being torn in in any dispute. We don't want to hear it! Business differences are to be resolved discretely in order not to hurt the industry as a whole. For those of you participating in this blog but not being a business- but a salaryman, don't complain about the firm you wish to leave during a job interview. For that the same reasoning applies, It is not done and you leave a very bad impression on the firm you want to join.
2) As such maybe because of this information you give, I would be cautious in striking a deal with Mr. Barnett or Shoreline but certainly I would not deal with any of you for sure! You disqualify yourselves as serious businessmen.
3) When you go into business you must know that "you will win some and you will loose some." If you can't handle the loosing of some money whatever the cause I strongly reccommend you to find a job and leave all the direct risks with your employer. I have read a post here of someone losing GBP 800 of his wealth. I don't want to play the amount of money down but GBP 800 really is not an excuse to virtually burn someone at the stake, like you do.
4 ) Apart from hurting the Shoreline cause which is obviously the sole purpose of this blog I am certain that it also helps Shoreline. There is scientific evidence available that the general public will, psychologically, either go for the winning party or for the underdog. You people display yourselves as victims rather than winners here but certainly Shoreline can capitalize on the position as the underdog. The whole thing is really very, very amateurish PR with too much emotions and no evidence shown from either side.
5) If Mr. Barnett or his firm have done wrong why don't you people go to court? If evidence can be produced that is probably the most effective strategy to straighten things out or even get at Shoreline if that is what you people are after. The same holds true for Shoreline. If I ran this company and being confronted with the persistent viciousness of the accusations I would have hired a sollicitor and would go to court.
6) The whole thing is too obsessively written to make use of the phrase "megalomaniac" for the opposite party. And "fatgirl" come on boys, get a grip!
7) You guys thoroughly shattered my presumptious image of the English as gentlemen in control of their emotions. Give me back the "stiff upper lip."

1) A fraction of the people TB/SL have upset are involved directly in the PB business. Many are simply players who have had bad experiences.
2) Those that are in the business here who have grievances with TB/SL are serious business persons. They run successful events, manufacturer product, sell product and are trusted by large multinationals. TB/SL are the small fry in comparison to many.
3) Agreed, 800gbp isn't much but PB is a business of tight margins at times and many have been screwed out of much larger amounts. Also, pissing off customers is never acceptable, regardless of the cash involved.
4) I'll agree with you here, at times the attacks can appear to galvanise TB/SL's position. But the evidence suggests that his customer numbers are falling, he'll always have some fanboys who think they owe some loyalty but they are being whittled down and it seems they are barely enough to keep this motors turning.
5) As I understand it, some of the aggrieved parties are taking legal action.
6) Agreed, much of this thread is obsessively written and chock full of hyperbole. Regardless of emotion, the facts are the facts, TB owes a fortune to companies and has a history of upsetting business partners and customers by over-promising and under-delivering
7) May I ask how your marijuana and tulip businesses are going? Stereotypes are nonsense.

 

[Robbo]

I've written my response to jan 'horses' hoof but I'm hesitating in posting it, I might send it to Dusty before I post it .... but before I do that, can I ask some of the people here who've posted re their experiences with barnett, does hoof's post not insult you in some way ???

To me, hoof's post is an arrogant, ignorant attempt at trying to look clever but he's done it on the basis of nothing more than a skim-read and hasn't even bothered to read this thread before posting his opinion ... to my mind, he has no right to pass an opinion on anything when self-evidently he has no experience of our industry or indeed knows any of its main players ...

 

[Robbo]

H, your number 7 is exactly what I was thinking too :/

 

[Bolter]

There is also the fact that anyone who complains with shoreline, gets banned, and all comments removed. Then you get attacked, called grubby bedsit dwelling whatever he said, websites created with the purpose of destroying people and if you are really lucky, maybe TB will tell people you were weird with his kids.

So this forum, is a place where people can voice their opinion of him, good or bad. We don't delete it. That's the crux of the situation, he has no control here. But yea, since he has tried to destroy us all at one time or another, its fair to say we ain't having it, and it can wear thin.

 

[Dexter]

Well Robbo, not really.

I don't expect people with only a cursory interest to actually read all the pages in a 200 page thread, I mean sure that would be preferable but I don't expect it.

However it does lead to a situation like this where someone comes into a discussion with some form of bias in place, has a quick glance and sticks their opinion down.

We then have to do the little dance were currently participating in where we correct their points.

 

[Robbo]

Dex, 100 % agreed - and I think the point you make referring to the 'little dance' is a good one because it seems we have to do their reading for them or at least point them in the right direction but the biggest problem I have with someone like hoof is the fact he has this sense of entitlement whereby he feels a cursory read somehow validates his opinion over and above any of ours.
And the thing is, he completely ignores or dismisses the fact our dealings with barnett are a lot more extensive than his couple of 'hellos', bottom line is, the guy has had zero experience with barnett, hasn't even read this thread and on that basis, he starts getting on his high horse which I suppose is predictable with a surname like hoof ...

By the way, Dusty read my proposed past and passed it ready for publication but I fear I might be indulging my emotional side which according to hoof invalidates anything I might say .... hmm .... my finger still hovers mercifully over the 'post reply' .....

 

[Dusty]

It's not like you to hold back, you've mellowed I tells ya...

 

[Blackwing]

Dex, 100 % agreed - and I think the point you make referring to the 'little dance' is a good one because it seems we have to do their reading for them or at least point them in the right direction but the biggest problem I have with someone like hoof is the fact he has this sense of entitlement whereby he feels a cursory read somehow validates his opinion over and above any of ours.
And the thing is, he completely ignores or dismisses the fact our dealings with barnett are a lot more extensive than his couple of 'hellos', bottom line is, the guy has had zero experience with barnett, hasn't even read this thread and on that basis, he starts getting on his high horse which I suppose is predictable with a surname like hoof ...

No need to hesitate Robbo, I feel offended by this guy. He knows nothing about this issue. He can not say to me that tb is OK guy...he turned my brother against me saying lies outloud in public...heavy guns are out and we need to finish the job. PERIOD!!!