Referee's on Div 1 Field.

[Liam92]

Liam, I've replied to your email.

In regards to score sheets, your scores were on display all day with each game and points on display for all to see, so that any discrepancies could be recorded as you go (as far as I was aware, there was only 1 all day and quickly rectified thanks to our new system). As of Round 3, you'll also be able to view this on your mobile phones. To me, this is far better than signing a score sheet anyway, as it's in black and white for all to view.

Thanks Ainsley. I've no issues with not signing them for this very reason, was just after reading this thread that in retrospect, i was worried we were meant to do so. As mentioned in the email, the live scores was a big help and didn't lead to any issues in this department for us.

The obvious question is - if you knew you had to sign the sheet, did you approach the scoring pod at the end of each match, and sign the sheet?

You have to remember that there are not enough people who want to ref.

This means there are not any spare personnel to go searching for someone to sign the scoresheet, as the refs don't get a break between points or matches like the players do. They have to clean bunkers, countdown the time between points and deal with any disputes.

I would suggest that, if any of you are unhappy with the quality of the reffing at the CPPS, look to yourselves for a soultion - ref the next event.

Dan, there was no requirement to sign sheets on the day (on our field anyway) for the reason i've expressed above.

I've done my fair share of reffing at CPPS and I fully appreciate how hard the job is when you're short staffed. However I don't expect any ref to have to babysit any team by chasing them to sign score sheets, but it's not an issue in the first place.

Telling me to go ref doesn't solve anything. I've paid to attend an event and gave feedback on issues that arose to help make the service better. To be honest I'm not about to drive a 500 mile round trip just to try and do a better job and miss out on playing, when i know that the referees are more than capable of building on their experiences to make them even better in the future.

 

[WihGlah]

Think about it - when a football match goes into extra time, is the game paused?

err - yes it is. You are thinking of time added on for injuries.

HOWEVER:

I thought the refs on the Div 2/3 field did a fantastic job. I witnessed one bad call all day. We all make mistakes, you have to take the rough with the smooth.

I also saw the disgracefull display by one team that led to 3 one for one's after they had G5 (which meant a no score point). The refs were professional and acted with restraint.

My team picked up 3 one for ones the whole day, one of which was a bit harsh, but the others were probably good calls.

 

[shootinropez]

I'm not one to judge refs at all, I think they do an excellent job and one that I'm sure most people on this forum wouldn't want to do as they'd rather play paintball at these amazing tournaments. I appreciate all the work they do and sacrifice the time that they do.
The reffing was very good on the D5 field yesterday with few discrepancies, but there are 2 instances that stick on my mind, both of which I spoke to the ref about, and got the reply "it wouldn't make a difference". As much as I know that its a difficult job for them, I don't think that's sufficient. And now that I think about it, it's incorrect. In both situations, there were 2 players alive, and with 2 1-for-1's, that would have made the points a draw i believe, and maybe would've pushed our ranking. Now, it certainly didn't mean we could've won the division, but finishing in a higher place would've been nice.
I just think sometimes there was a little inconsistency in refs.
For example, I had a hit on my hopper that i didn't know about, the ref came and called me out, and called a 1-for-1 on me. I agree that this is a fair punishment, for a self-check area, and i took my punishment and walked off the field, head low, angry at myself for making said mistake.
The problem is, that a few games later, there was 2v2 situation where a guy ran through and got both of us; however he had a large orange hit on his hopper. After the buzzer was pushed, the ref checked him and found the hit, and called him out, but didn't call a 1-for-1. I just think that the same crime deserves the same punishment, especially when this would've put us in an advantageous 2on1 situation and possibly won the point.
The second example is similar except that the hit was on the front of his pack, right in view of all refs and players.

Again, I'm not saying the refs were bad-quite the opposite. I'm very happy with the job they did, i just would like to see a little more consistency in the calls, either hits on hoppers are 1for1's or they're not.

But, that being said. THANK YOU to our refs, we appreciate what you do, and Ainsley, you run an awesome field, tournament etc, so thanks to you as well!

 

[Thorpe]

For what its worth, thanks to all the refs on the Elite field. Firm but fair calls from what I could see all day long and all the refs are happy to explain a call to you if you approach them politely.

 

[Liam92]

Again, I'm not saying the refs were bad-quite the opposite. I'm very happy with the job they did, i just would like to see a little more consistency in the calls, either hits on hoppers are 1for1's or they're not.

But, that being said. THANK YOU to our refs, we appreciate what you do, and Ainsley, you run an awesome field, tournament etc, so thanks to you as well!

completely agree with this. Yes i had some issues, but overall the games were very well ran and i was happy with the quality of event as always!

 

[shootinropez]

On an unrelated note, I'd just also like to say best wishes and get well soon's to:
1) The young lady who had an asthma attack (?) on the D5 field, mid-game.
2) The Disruption(?) player who broke his leg(?)
I put the (?'s) because that's what i heard through the grapevine, so want to clarify i'm not putting that as fact

Very sorry to see things like this happen, and I'm sure they're no one's faults, but genuinely hope you're both OK and have speedy recoveries!

 

[MattC]

Not wishing to try and divert this away from the thread topic. I'm a little concerned no-one has created a feedback thread for Event 2.

No-one is as critical as the Event Staff when it comes down to judging our Events. Constructive criticism is always welcome. In fact its absolutely fundamental to improving the series.

 

[Dave284]

The problem is, that a few games later, there was 2v2 situation where a guy ran through and got both of us; however he had a large orange hit on his hopper. After the buzzer was pushed, the ref checked him and found the hit, and called him out, but didn't call a 1-for-1. I just think that the same crime deserves the same punishment, especially when this would've put us in an advantageous 2on1 situation and possibly won the point.

Actually, if the player was shot before he got to either of you, it would be a 2-4-1 penalty, a 2-4-1 is pulled for a player influencing the game in an advantageous way towards his team after being hit (in this example, eliminating yourself and your team mate with a hit on him, thus winning the game) meaning you'd of won that game. If it happened the way you said it did.

Moving on to feedback...

The reffing on the elite field was strict, but fair, although a few little discrepancies with some refs not pulling penalties when they were deserved, and pulling them when they weren't. But it was noticeably consistent and overall a good standard. The event, despite weather, was well run.

However, two niggles;
As a team we were left waiting for a long time between games, granted there was a no-show, but we were on quickly after lunch (or meant to be) and then not again until the final game of the day (bar finals) the wait came to about 2 and a half hours, which imo is a little long.

Second;
The catering didn't seem to be up to it's standards set in the first event, the food the same, but the wait times were rather large.

 

[Chiv de la Hoyde]

Interesting post.

As a Ref on Field 1, I was completely unaware of the "lack of enthusiasm" and "countless indecisions". As there were a number of very experienced refs on that field, I'm sure they will be interested by these comments.

Perhaps you should have taken the time to point out your concerns on the day to the Field Ultimate.

Out of interest - how many tournaments have you reffed?

Sorry sir, but by reading all of the above I take it YOU were the ref who made the wrong call regarding the overtime, and ALSO had to ask one of your referees 4 to 5 times to pull one of the sandbaggers players on a one for one, ALSO had a discussion with another ref regarding the amount of times one of your colleagues left the field. All of this occurred in front of players might I add, I have reffed at winter series leagues and I know it is no easy task, but when an ultimate tells you that you are wrong, it is simply unacceptable to refer to the rules of other sports as a DIVISION1 CPPS referee.
Again, I know it is not always easy, it's a difficult job, however, there is a certain standard expected when paying £250 of your hard earned money on entry fees.
That said, I think the ultimate should have overruled the initial decision of letting the game play on.
Just my 2p.

 

[f1nut2]

I will congratulate Ainsley and team on another great event in a relevant feedback thread.

In terms of reffing on the div 1 field. I felt that once again it was consistent, firm and fair. There will always be some close calls and some 50/50 decisions that have to made in a split second and in general I thought they were well called.

Like the first event the refs were always willing to explain their decisions to us which is greatly appreciated.

Some small constructive feedback. There were couple of occasions when we were spectating and felt that a ref could have gone to check a player quicker when a fellow ref indicated a possible hit. In the mean time the hit player continued to play and when the ref went to check and confirm the hit they only pulled the player and didn't award the 141 which from a spectator point of view looked like an obvious one.

The other piece of feedback was that with the two matches rotating we almost got caught out by the fact that the other 2 teams finished their match 4-0 and all of a sudden we had to be back on quicker than we expected. Our own fault I know as we should have been paying more attention to what was happening with the other match and listening closer to the timekeeper but was hard to hear the timekeeper over the other feild noise. Maybe a megaphone might help where there is not the electronic score board like on the elite feild. Might save the timekeepers voice a bit too. Lol

In our second match I believe London fearless got caught out by the same thing when we 3-1 up and it allowed us to run down un opposed to take the point.

As for the Overtime point situation. We as a team simply play to the hand signals and instructions the refs on the feild give us. Eg if they say 10 seconds we are ready to play. If they call time we stop. If we are allowed to play we keep playing. If we are eliminated we walk. We don't argue with the refs. If we have a question our captain on the feild asks the ultimate.

Thanks again to all those who agree to ref these events. Without you the events could simply not happen. Like all the teams in the CPPS who aspire to better themselves and constantly improve, I really now believe that the refs as a team are aspiring to do the same. Keep up the good work guys.

Thanks Craig Pickernell - Team Kinetic